Geco mount for the early Mosin Nagant snipers

[Vic]

I recently saw that Dmitry of our board here-Feldscher-had decided to have some reproduction Geco mounts and bases made in Russia. In addition he was also going to have some early Zeiss scopes made that were used with this type of mount. I quickly chimed in that I would like to obtain one of these sets and recently it arrived.
For those not familiar with the set up, during the early years of the Russian sniper program, the Soviets did not have the ability or equipment to mass produce optical lens's and so forth. Partly due to money nd partly due to facilities. So in the infancy of the Soviet sniper program of the early 1920's the Red Army had to look elsewhere for optical equipment and mounts. The primary source of fine optics in that day was Germany. So orders were placed for several different optical sights from makers such as Zeiss, Busch, Hensoldt and Voightlander to name a few.
The purpose of these scopes was to conduct trials with various mounting systems provided. The spit bridge tube by Zeiss was tried but found to be over complicated. The version that drew attention was a side mounted bracket with base developed by the Gustav Genschow company known as "Geco" commercially by the logo. This mounting system was a large dovetailed base that allowed a mating split ring one piece mount to be slid on and affixed with a large thumb screw. The rings were solid and required the scope to be silver soldered in place.
After many trials and errors the decision was to proceed with rough 170 of these types of mounts fit to Mosin Nagant rifles model 1891 (dragoon length as this was the standard length in 1926). Two types were used. The first had no provision for the range plate on the side of the mount. That was because the scopes were made with range graduations that were not based upon the 1907 cartridge in 7.62x54r. The shooter was supposed to "memorize" the correct adjustments. The other was the large thumb screw was attached to the base by use of a small chain attached to the top. This system was used on rifles assembled at the "Dynamo" facility and became known as the D-2 system. The scopes used were the Zeiss manufactured optics whose components were made in Germany and assembled then shipped to the Zeiss affiliate Nedinsco located in the Netherlands. This allowed Germany to circumvent the restrictions placed upon them by the Versailles treaty that ended WW1.
The second system produced at Dynamo had an improved scope that allowed lateral adjustment for windage on the side of the tube and a slightly modified mount. The mount now had a ballistic plate attached to the side that allowed the shooter a quick reference as to the proper setting of the range on the elevation dial for the 54r cartridge. Also the chain was removed from the mount.
The scope and mount I received from Feldscher is absolutely wonderful. The scope is a reproduction of the early Zeiss Zeilvier scope purchased under contract. It is nicely blued and the optics are crisp and clear with a standard three post reticule of the day. Fit and finish were excellent and the marking superbly reproduced along with a serial number of the period.. The ocular bells were easy to unscrew and allow the scope to be placed into the rings of the mount.
Geco 9.JPG Geco 10.JPG Geco 1.JPG
The mount was equally well made. I was quite surprised to see the range estimation conversion plate affixed to the side as on the D-3 series of trial mounts. The mount is just different enough to not be confused with the original in that it incorporates some features of the D-3 system but with subtle changes like a lock screw on the front ring side and the use of a elevated thumb screw housing which was not used on the original mount. The scope used is a D-2 style so the mix of the two systems while possible and probable are another give away. The fit, bluing and function of the mount was excellent. I was equally blown away with the marking of the Genschow company placed on the mount in the correct location and style.
Geco 4.JPG Geco 8.JPG
The base is a large slab style dovetail as it should be for use on the flat sided hexagonal receiver. The piece even places the rear mounting screw slightly lower as it should be to allow mounting in the receiver in the proper location at the rear receiver bridge at the stripper clip guide. The bottom of the base has a relief cut in it to allow the function of the interrupter to work properly by sliding out slightly when the next shell is seated in the magazine. This was a really nice touch and only an experienced collector and engineer would have caught this feature.
Geco 6.JPG Geco 5.JPG
My scope fit the rings perfectly with just enough friction to allow easy fit through the rings. The base and mount also is provided with the two mounting screws and pins as well as the locking screws. The mounting screws are not relieved or indexed so that they can be properly fit when the mount is affixed properly. The fit of the base and the mount is excellent and easily slid into place against the stop pin.
Geco 7.JPG
This set is absolutely wonderful in appearance and style. The markings are excellent and the fit and function of the scope and mount to base are wonderful. The whole rig as a set is fantastic. These scopes and or mounts are absolutely impossible to find since they were made as "samples" and limited production on the hopes that the Red Army would adopt the system and order thousands more. The fact is that the system to procure these mounts and the money to pay for them was very poor to say the least. Some of the orders were defaulted on others were never completed due to the complexity of mounting them on the Mosin receiver. To be able to find an original would be a coup of a lifetime and would cost the collector or museum many thousands of dollars. If a correct side mount Izhvesk made PEM system can be found for less then 2500.00 then its a steal. The Dynamo D-2 or D-3 system with Geco mount would be double or triple that in my book.
This outstanding reproduction of the Dynamo D2/3 trial scope set up used on Mosin Nagant rifles from 1926 to 1931 by Feldscher is a must have for a serious Russian sniper rifle collector. It would be the only chance a Russian collector would have to add one of these style of rifles to their collection. If you have the ability of to obtain one of these scope and mount sets from Feldscher then I highly recommend it if you are serious about collecting Mosin Nagant sniper rifles or want something that nobody else will have. I am informed that a very limited number of these sets are available and that it is a once they are gone they are gone deal. It is my recommendation that you contact Feldscher ASAP if interested in one of these sets and reserve one now. They are that good.

If you would like to place and order PM Feldscher for more info and cost.

Geco 7.JPG

The following pictures of the mount and base attached to the 1928 dated Tula manufactured rifle that had been initially set up with this type of scope mounting system. The pictures show the fit to receiver and the placement for your reference. The rifle is in Feldscher collection and was his impetuous to have the scope and mount made. Note the fit of the base in relation to the interrupter. I've been told the relief is slightly undersized and would need to be lengthened slightly to allow for more room when the interrupter is pressed out by a cartridge.

[Vic]

Here is part two of the review with the base mounted to the rifle.

Geco 11.JPG

Geco 12.JPG

Geco 13.JPG

Geco 14.JPG

Geco 15.JPG

Geco 16.JPG

Geco 17.JPG

[Feldscher]

First of all I would like to Thank Vic for his time and this outstanding review of my project.
I got several more "Dynamo" sets this week. Some of the are already sold, few more are still available.
I figured people who bought them may have some questions or need additional information/photos. So, I will start posting pictures and info here on "as needed basis".

Related link:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=11503

[6thsf]

As stated above I received my repro Geco set from Feldscher yesterday, what a nice piece of craftsmanship. I cannot believe he could produce and sell it for what he charged me, I would put the optics of the scope up against my Ajack scoped high turret any day of the week. If you ever wanted to have a recreation of the early Soviet sniping system now is the time. Now the only decision is to decide which Mosin to install it on. Thanks again!!!

[DaWoof]

First of all I would like to Thank Vic for his time and this outstanding review of my project.
I got several more "Dynamo" sets this week. Some of the are already sold, few more are still available.
I figured people who bought them may have some questions or need additional information/photos. So, I will start posting pictures and info here on "as needed basis".

Related link:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=11503

Dmitry, do you have any sets left to sell?...

[Feldscher]

Dmitry, do you have any sets left to sell?...

Yes,
PM sent.

[DaWoof]

Yes,
PM sent.

Received my GECO system from Dmitry and everything Vic says is spot on.
Now to find a proper rifle to put this beauty on...:D

[ExGrndPounder]

If you have a set left could you PM me with the price. Thanks.

[Feldscher]

Just wanted to add these related threads before they get lost:

My 1928 Tula (believed to be an ex-Geco sniper) restored:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=27856 (includes step-by-step photos of wooden cheekpiece).


Two good threads with some additional info and pictures of another possible ex-Geco sniper (Tula, 1934):
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=30940

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=32654


Duane's repro NKVD :cool: sniper:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=36741

[Feldscher]

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=37515

[Feldscher]

I just wanted to add couple pictures of early Geco mount D2 sniper system (bottom) VS late Geco mount D3 sniper system (top).
*********
Also, adding a link on D2 vs D3 mounts, "spoon" bolt handle, and stock inlet:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=55389

[Hugo75]

Dear sir, I am looking for a repro of a zielvier with focus adjustment and your scopes appear to be just that.
If they are still available, what would be the cost of scope alone, if sold that way, or for your complete set up.
I plan to scope a k98 since my eyes are giving up on me.
thanks

[LX Kid]

I'm interested in a Geco mount and scope and was wondering about availability and price. Do yo still have them left? Thanks, Ron REH20@verizon.net

[DaWoof]

I just wanted to add couple pictures of early Geco mount D2 sniper system (bottom) VS late Geco mount D3 sniper system (top).
*********
Also, adding a link on D2 vs D3 mounts, "spoon" bolt handle, and stock inlet:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=55389

Dmitry, Do you remember from your records if I received a D2 or D3 set-up?
I'm trying to decide if I need a spoon bolt or just the bent bolt...

[Feldscher]

Jerry,
I don't remmember.
But, I don't see what seems to be a problem.
It's easy to check.
Who has your set?

[DaWoof]

Just dug out the rifle with your scope system on it and it has focus adjustment plate on the mount, so must be the later or D3 set-up.
My normal bent sniper bolt should be correct then. It's on a 1930 upgraded Tula Dragoon rifle...Is the wooden cheekrest correct on the later ones?..

[lionart99]

where can I get a relica scope mount for my Nagant M38 at a affordable price. I'm not a heavy collector, I have just one M38 and have one eye so a scope is a big help to me. Will appreciate any members suggestions.
Lionart

[j.ashbrook]

First of all I would like to Thank Vic for his time and this outstanding review of my project.
I got several more "Dynamo" sets this week. Some of the are already sold, few more are still available.
I figured people who bought them may have some questions or need additional information/photos. So, I will start posting pictures and info here on "as needed basis".

Related link:
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=11503

Hello. I'm new to the forum, just wondering if you had any of the mosin-nagant scope systems still available for sale? Shoot me an email at j.ashbrook@wildblue.net Thanks

[ant67]

same here have you any left ,you can email me at anthonyharding@btinternet.com thanks