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  1. #1
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    Default M1 Garand reloading

    Is there any mystery or esoteric knowledge to this?

    I've heard the warnings of lots of folks who claim you should never shoot any commercial 30-06, and only feed your Garands M2 ball, but this seems a bit extreme sounding. Am I right?

    I'm just wondering what would be the problem with loading military cases (with the primer crimps swaged) with 150 gr. FMJ bullets on top of a moderate load of either IMR 4895 or 4064, topped with a decent crimp. Sound right?

    On a related note, exactly which commercial ammo is damaging to the Garands? I have a 500 round case of PMC 150 gr. SP ammo that was given to me that I don't want to limit to my Model of 1917 only.
    Thanks,
    Pat
    No one ever got into Valhalla unarmed.

  2. #2
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    The concern is gas pressure at the gas port. You can get an adjustable gas plug to vent excess pressure, but if you stick to IMR4895 and 150 grain bullets you'll be OK. I wouldn't chance it with the PMC unless you get the adjustable gas plug, but it's your op rod. I don't crimp for the M1.
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  3. #3
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    The key is using the correct powder. IMR4895 is a correct powder when reloading for the M1. A 150 gr bullet is also a good choice. I would not use commercial ammo in an M1. You might get by with 20-50-100 rounds or more but eventually it will catch up to you and your op rod will be history...
    "The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament..."

    I'm starting, to suspect that I, don't know how to use commas.

  4. #4
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    I've heard that IMR 4064 is also good; any experience with that?
    Pat
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  5. #5
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    Read this http://carnival.saysuncle.com/002449.html and then this http://www.m14.ca/reloading/14_loading.pdf the second article is more about 7.62 x 51 but there is some valuable M1 Garand info at the end.

    Actually most "too heavy bullets" for the Garand are also "Too Long Bullets" and properly seated have a OL to long to fit in the magazine. So if it won't fit down in the Magizine on the enbloc clip for sure don't shoot it.

  6. #6
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    Poot, my Hornady Sixth Edition shows that they used both IMR 4064 and IMR 4895 for 168gr and 178gr bullets for their M1 Garand data. They unfortunately did not list any IMR data for 150gr bullets but did list H4895 for 150 grainers at a max load of 46.4gr./2600fps. In comparison they listed max loads for H4895 for 168gr and 178gr bullets also at 46.4gr exactly with a velocity of 2600fps for the 168gr bullets and 2550fps for the 178gr bullets. Kinda odd but I've checked their numbers several times now.

    For 168gr bullets they list IMR4895 max at 47.1gr/2600fps. For IMR4064 they listed a max of 47.2gr/2600fps.

    For 178gr bullets they list IMR4895 max at 46.1gr/2550fps. For IMR4064 they listed a max of 46.7gr/2550fps.

    Using the 168gr IMR4895 and IMR4064 data in the 150gr loads should keep you somewhat safe, assuming it cycles your M1 Garand properly.

    Still kinda scratching my head on the exact same max powder charge with the H4895 data in all three bullet weights, but then again I'm not a Garand guy.

    As a sidenote Hornady listed their fastest M1 Garand 150gr loads using 46.4gr H335 and 47.9gr N-135 with both giving velocity in the 2750fps range.

    They stated their loads were developed using commercial Hornady/Frontier cases and Winchester LR primers and, of course, an M1 Garand, so the normal slight reduction of charge due to military cases may apply.

    Dale

  7. #7
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    The important factor is the burning rate. Here's a chart - http://www.imrpowder.com/burn-rate.html

    IMR4064 is close enough to IMR4895 that it doesn't cause a problem. Bullet weight isn't that important. M2 Ball is 150 gr but 168 gr is popular for target loads. 4895 was developed for M2 Ball, so that's what I use. If supply was a problem I might experiment with others.

    Get a McCann or Schuster adjustable gas plug if you want to shoot commercial ammo.
    -.- ....- - -.. --

    9 out of the 10 voices in my head told me to stay home and clean my guns today

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    Another issue with using commercial ammo is sensitive primers, with the free-floating pin in a Garand it could increase the chance of a slam fire. I either use military load or when I reload I use the CCI #34 primers. I've also heard that Winchester primers are safe enough but not sure on that, never used them for my Garand.

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    Here's a link to the NRA M1 Garand load data for 147 grain to 180 grain bullets hosted on Master Po's site. As others stated, the concern is gas port pressure - too much will over accelerate the oprod potentially damaging it or the heal of the receiver. Powders should be no faster than IMR3031 nor slower than IMR4064.
    In military cases 47 grains of IMR4895 or 48 grains of IMR4064 should duplicate M2 Ball.
    http://masterpostemple.bravepages.com/M1load.htm
    How many psi in a CUP?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poot View Post
    I'm just wondering what would be the problem with loading military cases (with the primer crimps swaged) with 150 gr. FMJ bullets on top of a moderate load of either IMR 4895 or 4064, topped with a decent crimp. Sound right?

    On a related note, exactly which commercial ammo is damaging to the Garands? I have a 500 round case of PMC 150 gr. SP ammo that was given to me that I don't want to limit to my Model of 1917 only.
    Thanks,
    Pat

    The caution against firing commercial .30-06 in the M1 Garand is legitimate. The Gas port pressures created by using commercial ammo are too high for the system as it was designed. IMR 4895 and 4064 are in the class of proper powders to be used in the M1 Garand. 150 grain FMJ all the way through 174 Grain Sierra HPBT Match projectiles are suitable for use.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wade67 View Post
    Another issue with using commercial ammo is sensitive primers, with the free-floating pin in a Garand it could increase the chance of a slam fire. I either use military load or when I reload I use the CCI #34 primers. I've also heard that Winchester primers are safe enough but not sure on that, never used them for my Garand.
    I've heard both sides of this argument for years. I've also shot thousands of my own reloads, some with CCI #34 primers and more with the much-maligned Federal primers - never had a slam-fire. Never met anyone who has. I wouldn't go so far as to label it an Internet myth, but I think the more likely culprit is a primer that is not seated flush, or below flush, regardless of the type. I would recommend thoroughly cleaning the bolt on a newly acquired M1, but taking that apart the first time is an adventure!

    On the other hand, I have had misfires using CCI #41 primers in my M1 Carbine. They almost always fire on the second strike. A new Wolff spring set is on my wish list, but I don't worry much about slam-fires.
    -.- ....- - -.. --

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  12. #12
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    Guys,
    Thanks for all of the very helpful comments and links. Sounds like I'll be fine with 4064 then. I have some CCI and some new Wolf primers that I'll use. I'm probably going to use the military brass exclusively, although I have a bunch of commercial cases, too. With the military cases I'll assume that I'll need to back the charge off about 10% due to the thicker walls.
    Thanks again,
    Pat
    No one ever got into Valhalla unarmed.

  13. #13
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    I agree with you TDM but if it is something that increases a level of safety in reloading I usually tend go that route. I have never had an issue with the US weapons but I have had with similar design bolts such as the SKS. It’s a rarity but I had a slam fire using commercial ammo in an SKS, cracked off three rounds before I knew what happened. I know they are two different animals but the bolts slam home just the same. With a $1000+ dollar gun such as the Garand I usually take all the precautions I can when reloading. I don’t use commercial ammo because reloads are just too easily manufactured. Also, I always figure that if something rare is going to happen such as out of battery or slam fire to anyone it will happen to me so I try my best to avoid the situation. In my early days of reloading I did have a squib in a Garand that could have been a catastrophe but I was quick enough to realize what had happened before I pulled the trigger again. Yes, I was dumb enough to chamber another round not thinking there was a bullet stuck in the barrel. The primer had enough force that the bullet was about two inches into the barrel. Double and triple checking powder levels in reloading is not a bad habit to have. Reloading for semi autos is a different ball game than reloading for bolt actions with obvious reasons. Shooting home grown ammo or military spec over commercial ammo is the choice of the person shooting. However, I like to know what’s in my food before I eat it.
    Last edited by Wade67; 04-27-2010 at 02:29 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poot View Post
    With the military cases I'll assume that I'll need to back the charge off about 10% due to the thicker walls.
    With 150 grain bullets in military cases, 48 grains of IMR 4064 will duplicate M2 Ball. This is a load I use and it will not stress you M1. You should work up to it from 45 grains just to be safe with your components.
    Last edited by Ordtech; 04-28-2010 at 01:11 AM.
    How many psi in a CUP?

  15. #15
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    Thanks Ordtech, sounds good-
    Pat
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    I have been told by a fellow match shooter that the marine core match team would load with 4350.

    Personally I use 48 grains of AA2495 with a 150 grain bullet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleGarunt View Post
    I have been told by a fellow match shooter that the marine core match team would load with 4350.
    .
    Sure....they put that "word" out so all the 'wanna bees' drop out of the match with a fubar'd op-rod. I really doubt that they were using IMR4350 in a Garand. That is TOO SLOW for a 173gr bullet in that rifle and goes against all other "expert shooter/reloaders" using that rifle.

  18. #18
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    Here is a list of Garand loads that have been tested by myself and/or members in my club.Garand Loads.pdf

  19. #19
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    Gentleman, I am also very new to reloading. I just made some ammo for my M1. I did the folllowing low load that I got from my Lymans Manual: 44.4 grains of IMR 4894 with a 147 gr. bullet. I am just a target plinker and only shoot at paper targets between 50 to 100 yards. Is it ok to shoot this low load in my M1.

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    Sorry meant 4895.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by trutracer View Post
    I got from my Lymans Manual: 44.4 grains of IMR 4894 with a 147 gr. bullet.
    Yes it's safe assuming it is loaded correctly. It's a start load and on the low side so you may see function reliability issues, i.e. short stroking, wherein the bolt is not pushed back far enough to pick up the next round in the clip. If it functions your rifle, it would be a nice light load. Otherwise, work up until the rifle functions reliably. This load won't match your sight markings beyond 100 yards if you zero your 100 notch to this load.
    How many psi in a CUP?

  22. #22
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    I would like point out that the self-appointed and anointed masters of all that is M1 Garand at Fulton Armory recommend not reloading for Garands (or anything). I think this is for many reasons, one being that they probably see many Garands with bent op-rods because of some of the stuff I am reading in this thread.

    To begin with, let's examine what makes Garands special for reloading purposes. It is for one reason: the relatively narrow port pressure parameters that the rifle operates within.

    Port pressure is the amount of pressure at the gas port, located about 3/4" from the muzzle. Too much port pressure may accelerate the op-rod too hard and bend it when it reaches its stop. Too little will provide insufficient force to push the op-rod to the point where the hammer is re-cocked. Much of the commerical .30-'06 out there has the potential to damage a M1 Garand. Avoid it unless you enjoy the fine art of bending op-rods back into shape.

    There are two ways to modify a Garand to increase the maxim port pressure parameter. The cheapest and best way, but a somewhat tricky way, is to drill a hole in the gas cylinder just behind where the piston part of the op-rod is positioned when the hammer is just cocked. This way all the pressure needed to cock the hammer will be available, and then as soon as its cocked, the now unneeded pressure will bleed off. Another inferior and more expensive way to accomplish sort of the same thing is to buy a gas cylinder nut with a hole drilled in it or buy a surplus one and drill a hole in it yourself. You will need to find the right sized hole for the load you are using. It also doesn't bleed off unneeded pressure as well and may actually increase the lower port pressure parameter (narrowing the parameter).

    If you don't want to get into this "modification" (aka improvement) work, then you MUST select your charge and bullet carefully. Fortunately the US Army Ordanance people already gave us good guidelines: duplicate ball ammo loads.

    It is not overreaching to say that most new commercial .30-'06 is inapporate for Garands--it is! It is designed for bolt-actions, which don't even have a gas port! Often it uses the heavy bullets with slower powders in order to get maximum muzzle energy, range, etc. H4350 (and similar) is a slow powder, designed for magnum rifle cartridges, and is inappropiarate for a Garand. To have the port pressures in a safe area a very light bullet would be needed and a light bullet would not provide the inertia needed to "cork-up" the power and allow it to "get going" and produce a good pressure curve. I suppose a MEGA crimp could be used, but this will distort the bullet and probably impair accuracy. Or perhaps a magnum primer. But this is all very unsure. Why not just use a more appropriate powder and sacrifice, lets say, 200 FPS?

    The best powder for the beginner reloader of a M1 Garand is H4895, since this powder is an analog of the millitary powder the Garand was designed for. The best bullets are in the 150-173 grain (also ball) area. Also, the maximum charge of H4895 in a Garand should be a might bit lower than what a typical reloading manual will list as a Max load. Usually the starting loads are where the max is approximately for a Garand.

    Ball ammo went at about 2700 FPS out of a Garand with a 150 grain bullet. A heavier bullet should be slightly slower. Get some Greek .30-06 from the CMP. At $0.50 a pop (and on en-bloc clips), its the best deal out there except 7.62x54R surplus. Actually, don't buy the Greek stuff, because I would rather buy it myself. If you want to spend more money per round, Both Federal and Hornady make .30-'06 for Garands. The Hornady uses quality bullets and is sold (at a discount supposedly) by the CMP. I have never used the Federal, but I am confident it is good stuff. It better be at $1/round.

    My recipie: HXP (Greek surplus, RCBS primer pocket swaged) brass full-length resized with Lee dies. 43 Grains of H4895 with a 168 Grain Hornady match bullet seated to max OAL that will chamber and then backed off ten thousandths. It is best to prime anything with a free-floating firing pin (M1A, Garand, AR-15, later SKSs, and many, many others), with harder primers or even primers that are designed for free-floating firing pins in order to help prevent slam fires (of course correct firearms safety and proper handling will completely prevent this). I use CCI, the hardest that are available to me. Winchester would be my second choice. The softest primers are Federal and should be avoided. Supposedly the Federal .30-'06 for M1 Garand has special primers, and this would seem to suggest that Federal knows that their primers are soft.
    Last edited by curioushooter; 05-01-2010 at 09:47 AM.

  23. #23
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    CCI 34 are made for use in semiauto rifles with floating firing pins to reduce the possibility of premature firing.
    Wolf primers are also on the harder to ignite side and good for M1/M14/M1a loads. It's more about sensitivity than hardness of the cup.
    What is usually described as "slamfires" is firing out of battery due to high primers. Military cases should be decrimped and the primer pocket uniformed. Primers should be felt with a finger to assure they are seated below the case base.
    And Fulton recommends not reloading because most of the damaged rifles Walt has seen were caused by bad reloading. Plus they sell rifles and no manufacturer warrants their product if reloads are used. I wouldn't because I can't control what you do.
    How many psi in a CUP?

  24. #24
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    One note on CCI #34 primers.....if you read the fine print in the Speer reloading manual, it warns you that the #34 primer is a magnum primer....adjust your loads accordingly to avoid excessive pressure. I like the primers and use them often, but I do take the primer type into account when working up a load.
    Geal us dearg a suas!

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    That's one thing about the Wolf primers that gets a bit lost. I bought a load (10K) of Wolf SR Magnum primers for 5.56 and 6.8SPC. These are not 'true' magnum primers in the sense that they have greater ignition. They are labelled as such because of the hardness of the cup, which is obviously a benefit in a weapons system with a floating firing pin. Their 'magnum' style primers are actually what they call their '5.56' primers.

    A bit confusing, huh?!
    Pat
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  26. #26
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    I can't really choose what kind of primer I get. I get what is available to me and avoid less-than-well understood Russian primers. In general, CCI standard primers, which are relatively hard, are a better choice for a rifle with a free-floating firing pin than your major alternatives: Federal, Remington, and Winchester.

    That being said any primer for a rifle with a free-floating pin is going to be ideal. If that is #34, so be it, but I have never been able to obtain this type, so it doesn't do me (or others like me) much good.

    What is usually described as "slamfires" is firing out of battery due to high primers.
    I am confused, so I will use a Garand for example: bolt rotates closed and lugs are in their recesses (in battery) while the free-floating firing pin continues to travel forward and strikes the primer, detonating it. Notice, the trigger was not squeezed--the hammer was not released and did not fall on the primer. This is not an out-of-battery fire. This is a slam-fire, right? The inertia of the firing pin is what provides the force that detonates the primer. This is why Garand firing pins were lightened early in the Garand's development. Reducing mass reduced the inertia which brought it below adequate to detonate the standard (new) military primer used in standard conditions.

    Slamfires can happen, and that is why on a Garand is it unwise to let the bolt rapidly accelerate forward. There are devices (like the SLED) that can prevent this mechanically (and are a good prophylactic), but good training and exercising control of the weapon will prevent slamfires 100% of the time. Incorrectly seated primers can increase the likelihood that a tap from a firing pin could be enough to detonate the primer. Seating them correctly is important and I do agree that having the primer pockets uniformed, particularly if military brass is being used, is important.

    Out-of-battery fire can be due to a slamfire, but need not be. Out-of-battery fire is when the primer is detonated while the bolt is not closed and locked and the lugs are not in their recesses (hence out-of-battery). If a firing pin is too long for example (and this is a rather remote example), it can strike the primer before the bolt has closed. A primer being not seated deep enough can certainly cause a problem. And out-of-battery fire is dangerous for another reason--the case may rupture (since it is not being supported) or may accelerate the bolt reward violently.

    Interestingly, some rifles, like the M3 "grease gun," work by slam-firing. Their pins are fixed to the bolt and when the non-locking bolt travels forward to a point it strikes the primer with a enough force to detonate the primer, the simple inertia of the massive bolt is used to retard the reward acceleration of the bolt along with a spring. The trigger released the bolt, not a striker or hammer that strikes a firing pin.

  27. #27
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    Exactly as I said. High primers account for many of what are called slamfires. As the bolt cams closed it fires the primer. Has nothing to do with the firing pin striking it. US Ordnance taught me so. I respect that opinion over many armchair experts.
    Dave Tubb won the Highpower Championship using "the less-than-well understood" Russian primers. Kind of puts your opinion in perspective.
    How many psi in a CUP?

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    Quote Originally Posted by curioushooter View Post
    Slamfires can happen, and that is why on a Garand is it unwise to let the bolt rapidly accelerate forward. There are devices (like the SLED) that can prevent this mechanically (and are a good prophylactic), but good training and exercising control of the weapon will prevent slamfires 100% of the time.
    The SLED is handy for firing single rounds, but a lousy prophylactic. Terribly uncomfortable and not effective at all. . . .
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    I am not wasting my time in this thread anymore. It just irritates me. I will point out something though...

    but a lousy prophylactic. Terribly uncomfortable and not effective at all. . .
    Ha ha. But look up the definition of the word. You will see what I mean.

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    Quote Originally Posted by curioushooter View Post
    I am not wasting my time in this thread anymore. It just irritates me. I will point out something though...



    Ha ha. But look up the definition of the word. You will see what I mean.
    Lighten up, Francis.
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    A while back I ordered some , http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/...roductId/12613 RG4895 from Wideners, and prepped some once fired Korean PS stamped brass. Anyone have a powder charge for the Radway Green 4895? Or should I load the same as IMR?
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    I read through this thread of highly informative data to determine if I should crimp the brass for the M1 Garand. I see it mentioned just once and wondered what others opinions are. I have not reloaded for this rifle as I have plenty of mausers and enjoyed shooting them alot. Now I am ready to start reloading for my M1 Garand. I appreciate all the great experience folks have. Thank you.

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    I use a Lee factory Crimp die on practically everything I reload... especially on something that is as hard slamming as a Garand when it chambers a round... Twice, before I started crimping, I have had bullets move in the case on a Garand.. and I only know about those two because I had to clear my loaded weapon while I still had rounds in the clip due to RSO called cease fires. God only knows how many set back bullets or bullets that went forward a little up the bore when the case stopped in the chamber I have fired.... maybe none...maybe more than I fear.... So now I crimp... might not be the best for accuracy, but it sure helps me sleep.
    Last edited by AmmoSgt; 06-17-2010 at 07:03 PM. Reason: realized I sounded like I have had crimped bullets move in the case, I haven't, the ones that moved were why I started crimp

  34. #34
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    I have fired several hundred loadings thru my Garands loaded exclusively with 4064 powder and either the 150 gr Speer or Nosler bullets but never used a crimp and never had any problems with either Win-Rem-CCI primers.

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    Thanks all for the information. I was planning to use H4895 with a 147 GR FMJBT with CCI Primers. I do not have Lake City Brass which is what I understand to be the recommended brass. Does this combination still sound reasonable? Oh yes was planning to start with 48 Grains. Thanks again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitetailchaser View Post
    Thanks all for the information. I was planning to use H4895 with a 147 GR FMJBT with CCI Primers. I do not have Lake City Brass which is what I understand to be the recommended brass. Does this combination still sound reasonable? Oh yes was planning to start with 48 Grains. Thanks again.
    Sounds quite reasonable and should come close to duplicating M2 Ball, though I do recommend working up to it from 45 grains just to be safe.
    How many psi in a CUP?

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    Thank you again. I will do that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitetailchaser View Post
    I read through this thread of highly informative data to determine if I should crimp the brass for the M1 Garand. I see it mentioned just once and wondered what others opinions are. I have not reloaded for this rifle as I have plenty of mausers and enjoyed shooting them alot. Now I am ready to start reloading for my M1 Garand. I appreciate all the great experience folks have. Thank you.
    I don't have a Garand, but a .308 BAR, and I run everything it digests thru a Lee Taper Crimp Die first, and have never had a problem with bullets moving, and that is with non-cannelured bullets most fo the time.

  39. #39
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    What about IMR-4895? Aren't H4895 and IMR-4895 nearly identical? Reason I ask is my Garand is my XTC (across the course for the uninitiated) gun and I am running low on M72 Ball. By the end of this season (and probably by July) I will be handloading for 600 slow fire and shooting CMP Greek HXP at 200 and 300. Bullets for now will be pulled M118s, then on to my stash of SMK 168s which will be replaced by 175 SMKs. The 175 is almost identical to the old M72/M118 and is a better bullet for 600. Bucks the wind better and it goes in all sorts of directions at Oak Ridge and is even stranger than THAT at Perry.
    Formerly known as Dave the Krag Man

    The Krag Rifle: The Hamilton Watch of milsurp!

    Currently after 1919-23 Tula 91, ex-Dragoon or Dragoon. PM with details.

  40. #40
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    The 4895's are very similar, I wouldn't go as far as to say "nearly identical".

  41. #41
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    Another thumbs up for crimping. I've had nothing but positive results from doing so.
    Pat
    No one ever got into Valhalla unarmed.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plain Old Dave View Post
    What about IMR-4895? Aren't H-4895 and IMR-4895 nearly identical?
    IMR-4895 was developed in 1941 specifically for 30-06 in the M1 Garand rifle. The military loads are with IMR, not H-4895, and all the Ordnance Dept reference manuals list IMR-4895 vice H. Hodgdon started selling surplus 4895 after the war and when it ran dry, had it manufactured as H-4895. It is close but, not identical. It is safe to use if you loads are of similar pressure to the IMR-4895 loads. IMR-4064, IMR-3031, and Varget are also popular and IMR-3031 is the fastest powder you should use, IMR-4064 is the slowest (or powders close to them in burn rate).
    The NRA recommendation hosted on Master Po's site lists plenty of loads with numerous powders that are safe in the M1 Garand. It lists the suitable IMRs, W748, AA powders, Alliant Reloader Powder, and Hodgdon BL-c2 & H-335.
    http://masterpostemple.bravepages.com/M1load.htm (Note: Master Po's website has irritating popup adds but, they pay for his hosting)
    Here's a link to history at IMR which, ironically, is owned by Hodgdon now. Hodgdon manufactures and distributes both IMR and H versions of the powder. http://www.imrpowder.com/history.html
    How many psi in a CUP?

  43. #43
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
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    Back in the 1980's when we fired to earn our M1 Garands they told us when we start to reload for them to use nothing faster than IMR-3031 and nothing slower than IMR-4064. But that was then and I am sure there are many new powders that work well.

    burgie

  44. #44

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    I have always used 4895 in my M-1 Garands. I realize that there are other powders that can be used. But I guess my question is this. Is there any advantage to using any of theses other powders that any of you have found? Cheaper? Cleaner? More accurate? Easier on the gun?

    I guess Im in a rut with the 4895 after all these years and if there is something better out there now Id be glad to listen. Any ideas?

  45. #45
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    Gentlemen, read the whole thread. He got his answer long ago. You're a year late.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ordtech View Post
    Here's a link to the NRA M1 Garand load data for 147 grain to 180 grain bullets hosted on Master Po's site. As others stated, the concern is gas port pressure - too much will over accelerate the oprod potentially damaging it or the heal of the receiver. Powders should be no faster than IMR3031 nor slower than IMR4064.
    In military cases 47 grains of IMR4895 or 48 grains of IMR4064 should duplicate M2 Ball.
    http://masterpostemple.bravepages.com/M1load.htm
    How many psi in a CUP?

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