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Thread: LLama 9mm/38

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    Default LLama 9mm/38

    I just picked up a LLama 9mm/38 pistol. I understand from what i have read that i can shoot 9mm largo and 38super out of it??? I'm not sure yet thats why i'm asking here.
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    Not super , i think they mean 38 auto



    fiveshot

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911crazy View Post
    I just picked up a LLama 9mm/38 pistol. I understand from what i have read that i can shoot 9mm largo and 38super out of it??? I'm not sure yet thats why i'm asking here.
    If it is chambered for 9mm Largo, you can shoot .38 AUTO, NOT .38 Super.

    9mmLargo is a roughly 28,000psi class cartrige.
    .38 Auto is a lower pressure cartrige, down arround 21-23,000psi or so.
    38 Super is a 35,000psi cartrige, and as such, is basically a 9mmLargo PROOF LOAD.

    It's been argued here before, I will say, again, don't do Super in it.

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    Thanks for the info. There's lots of miss information on the net when i search it about wether its 38auto/38acp or 38 super so i asked here before doing anything. Sorry to bring it up again.
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    There is no stupid question you can ask about appropriate/safe ammo for a new gun:

    If you don't know the answer, the question is NOT stupid.

    The most you can demonstrate by asking is ignorance (which means you don't know - and want to be educated). There is nothing wrong with ignorance, as long as you realize you do have a void in knowledge and try to cure that.
    Absent comrades (sound of breaking glass)

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    Good point Clyde. I would rather folks ask first, rather than experiment and hurt themselves.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clyde View Post
    There is no stupid question you can ask about appropriate/safe ammo for a new gun:

    If you don't know the answer, the question is NOT stupid.

    The most you can demonstrate by asking is ignorance (which means you don't know - and want to be educated). There is nothing wrong with ignorance, as long as you realize you do have a void in knowledge and try to cure that.
    Absolutely correct.

    No problem 1911crazy.
    I'd rather correct that info a hundred times than have someone blow up a perfectly nice pistol needlessly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob In St. Louis View Post
    Good point Clyde. I would rather folks ask first, rather than experiment and hurt themselves.
    Ask me how i know about failing to ask about something you don't know the answer to sometime.
    Absent comrades (sound of breaking glass)

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    As others have said - 9mm Largo and .38 acp, aka .38 Auto. Do not attempt to shoot .38 Super out of it (or regular 9mm) unless you want to risk a ride in an advanced life support transport...read that as an ambulance to the nearest trauma center!

    My ASTRA 400 is marked 9mm/.38 but with an abundance of surplus 9mm Largo available ($475 for a 2,000 round case of non-corrosive ammo from Sarco) and the fact that .38 auto is hard to find and quite expensive, I'll stick to the 9mm Largo. It is plenty zippy and accurate for me...

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    No flame intended i went to the llama site and found many different models of the 1911a1 copy like i have here. So I'm not sure what i have exactly yet. I'm not shooting anything until i'm positive on what i have. I can't find a model # identification on it?? I disassembled it and looked all over it. It has no grip safety so that maybe a key on what caliber it is. This is one big heavy 1911a1 style pistol with a very thick barrel(walls). I'm not trying to push the 38 super in any way and "i won't ever shoot 38 super in my llama". But this is one impressive large 9mm pistol. Its been aresnal reblued but i'm not sure too because all the parts look unfired. There doesn't seem to be any wear at all on any parts. No wear on the slide face or barrel lugs\ too. So she is one purdy piece of hardware. Seeing how good she looks I may look for a llama 1911a1 in 45acp next. I hope i can nail down exactly what llama model the 9mm it is first.
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    Proof marks?What is the serial number? Does it have a small stylized "GC" monogram on the right side of the frame?
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    The markings are;

    Slide; GABILONDOY Cia ELGOIBAR (ESPANA)
    9mm 38 "Llama"
    Inside the slide is #272

    Frame;

    serial number #8550x
    letters "GC" in a circle

    Grips l & r are marked 272 and serial numbered to the gun.

    The frame, slide and barrel have the "P" in a circle with a flame or something on the top of the circle.

    lever is marked 272 and the barrel is marked 272 too.

    There is no grip safety

    The chamber is in 9mm largo. But the slide is marked 9mm 38?

    This is a very heavy pistol, much heavier and larger over the star pistols. Its like a full size 1911a1.
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    These are sometimes marked Llama "Extra" - when I get back to the hotel in about an hour, I will compare your serial number to my inventory listing and let you know the approximate year of production. Again, this is a 9mm Largo, and the "9mm/38" was a later stamping when imported to the US or Mexico to designate it can be used with the 38 ACP cartridge. The "P" in a flaming bomb is an export proof mark; if it was used by the Spanish military it would have an "I" in the flaming bomb proof. The "GC" is a company monogram is for Gabilondo y Cia (Llama), but some folks confuse it with the Guardia Civil mark - I think Llama may have purposefully done that.
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    Oh, forgot - the "272" is an internal factory assembly code, not related to the serial number.
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    The 9mm 38 indicates 9mm Largo chambering as i understand it. If there is enough slack in the breech-face to accept the semi-rimmed 38 ACP, you cn use that - but please no 38 Super. Sounds to me like it is a Model IV.
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    I have a Llama Extra serial number 89123 that has a 1944 year code proof. Yours would fall late 1943 to early 1944.
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    Thanks its a llama extra in 9mm largo/38auto thats awesome. Where do i get mags for this? Does the 1911 parts fit this like the full length guide rod kits if i use the orginal recoil spring?

    In looking at the llama site they list a 9mm corto whats that??
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    9mm Corto is 380 ACP - totally different pistol. 1911 parts will not fit the Llama.
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    Thanks for all the help, i can't wait to shoot this heavy weight in 9mm largo.
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    also i think your pistol will shoot 9mm steyr

    fiocchi makes it and it aint cheap



    FIVESHOT

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    Quote Originally Posted by FIVESHOT View Post
    also i think your pistol will shoot 9mm steyr

    fiocchi makes it and it aint cheap



    FIVESHOT
    Stick to 9mm Largo. It is what the gun was designed and intended for.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clyde View Post
    Stick to 9mm Largo. It is what the gun was designed and intended for.
    A handloader can certainly make 9mm Largo from/in .38 Super brass cases............ (or 9x23)
    Last edited by Oldstuffer; 10-24-2010 at 07:46 AM.

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    9 x 23 --- 9x21 would be too short.
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    You can try some 1911 mags made for the 38 Super. I have heard they work but I never tried it myself.
    ~Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me~

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob In St. Louis View Post
    9 x 23 --- 9x21 would be too short.
    Yes indeed, brain fart. Thank you.

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    So let me see. First, I am not to shoot .45 acp in a shaved Mark VI Webley. Now, after 20 or 30 years of blasting various and sundry versions of 38 Super through a Llama Extra I am going to blow myself to smitheroons! Look the beastie is reliable and accurate using 38 Super ammo. OK, it is a bit more accurate with 9mm Bergman-Bayard , but I like the social implications of hollowpoints (darn near sent a 124 grain Winchester half-jacketed soft nose hp through a 02:45 intruder a while back, but that's another story).
    What is a person to do with all this newfound information. As to parts, over the years I've tinkered with 1911 barrels, springs, mags etc.(they interchage quite well) with no problems. However it does not like 9 mm luger and barely tolerates 9mm Steyer but those are not parts related.
    I suppose next that I am not supposed to run 45 Colt through an altered .455 S&W? OK. ok, so I can use the .455 Mk II I got for Old Ugly (Webley) but what about 32 S&W longs in the Tokerov?
    Aarrgh, you really don't want to know what I have run through long guns over the years!!! .......Skip

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    I just installed a 1911 full length guide rod kit and it fit the llama full size 1911 in 9mm largo even with the orginal llama recoil spring. The slide felt weak without the full length guide rod and now with the full length guide rod the recoil spring isn't coiling anymore its held straight by the guide rod so it even has more tention than without it too. I may try some lower tention 1911 new recoil springs in the llama and work the way up till it still functions flawlessly. I'm not sure whattention the orginal recoil spring is?
    Are you ready for 12-21-2012?? Lets pray its the second comming of Christ and not the end like so many predict.

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    Don't want to upset anyone as I'm a new member. "My" Llama Extra, ser#27697 handles 38 Super +P very well. I'm not advising anyone to shoot any type of ammo but I've had my Llama since 1965 and was told when I bought it at a department store in Alhambra, Calif. that it was 38 Super. I'm sure he was an "expert", I was gun dumb. The chamber is .90" and is cut in the barrel hood for the Colt acp semi-rimmed cartridge. Had it been intended only for the Largo/Bayard there would have been no need for the rim cut as the Largo is a rimless case. Also it is notable that the 38 Super was introduced before my pistol was made.
    My Extra is very well made and has handled a lot of 38 Super +P rounds with no sign of wear. Most 1911 parts will interchange. I'm still using the original recoil spring.
    If the 38 Super is a proof load equivilant for the 38 ACP then my Llama is very strong?
    This is not the same pistol as the ones of later years.
    Ed
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    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	372498Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	372499same here i have shot several boxes of 38 suer with no problems as matter of fact i have loaded 9mm largo and 38 super every other one and you could feel very little diff my llama extra serial 33041 is from 1936.

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