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  1. #1
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    Default OT: Danish police use of French pistols?

    My apologies for posting a quesiton here that is not about Krag rifles. I am trying to find some information about a possible Danish police sidearm and forums dealing with Danish firearms are rare. I have checked with the members of the French firearms forum on Gunboards without success. The firearms manufacturer has been closed for almost 30 years, and no significant history of it or its weapons is known to exist in any language. (The best is on the website Unblinking Eye: http://unblinkingeye.com/Guns/MABHist/mabhist.html, to which I am a contributor.)

    If you can suggest a better place to check on this, please let me know. I have been unsuccessful in finding a Danish firearms discussion website.

    I have noticed that a number of French MAB (Manufacture d’Armes de Bayonne, later Manufacture d’Armes Automatiques de Bayonne) model 7.65mm/.32 ACP model C/D semi-automatics dating to the 1950s - early 1960s have a prefix of "RPLT F." before the serial number, and that the s/n are unusually low, suggesting a limited series of pistols.

    The MAB C/D (officially, "extended grip model C") has a model C barrel and slide mounted on a model D frame, making it a short barrel but large magazine sidearm. The models C & D are essentially the same pistol, but the C is smaller (shorter barrel and shorter grip/magazine).

    MAB had a history of using special letter-prefix s/n series for pistols manufactured for French police and security forces, where the letters indicate the specific agency for which the pistols were intended. These include all French national armed law enforcement agencies (Surete, Customs, National Railway, Forestry, Bank of France, etc) as well as national and local police forces. The models C, C/D, and D are also known to have been used by German police forces following WWII.

    The only reference I have been able to find for "RPLT" markings is that the Danish national police use it to mark some of their weapons, where "RPLT" = "Rigspoliti" or "Rigspolitiet".

    What I am trying to find out is if anyone knows whether the Danish national police used MAB pistols in the 1950s or 1960s, and if the "RPLT" markings on the MAB pistols match those used on Danish police pistols.

    The odd thing here is that some of these MAB C/Ds are marked as "Made in France for WAC" and sold as new by WAC (WAC was the US importer WAC (Western Arms Corp, later Winfield Arms Corp, of Los Angeles; it was the primary importer of MAB pistols into the US from the late 1940s until the early 1960s.) MAB is known to have added "Made in France for WAC" (and sometimes added "for WAC" to pistols already marked "Made in France") to existing stock, sometimes of pistols no longer in production, when selling them to WAC. So one possible explanation for this "RPLT" marking is that these pistols, or at least the (model D) frames, were originally intended for the Danish national police but never sent to them for some reason and instead sold to WAC. The meaning of the "F" after the RPLT is unknown.

    Again, my apologies for being off-topic.

    Bill

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    MAB C/D

  2. #2
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    Default

    The general Danish Police Force did not carry sidearms until sometimes in the sixties, when some madman gunned down and killed four, unarmed Danish police officers. Up until that time, only the Danish motorcycle (Nimbus and BMW) police officers would normally carry, what appeared to some rather larger pistol in a fully enclosed, angled, left side holster, which I suspected was a Luger or P-38, both in 9mm ?

    I believe that after this needless slaughter of four unarmed Danish police officers, the remaining Danish police force, the very next day, were all issued with a Walter PP pistols, in 32 ACP ?

    Perhaps Niels or Lindvig could be kind enough to come up with a more accurate explanation in regards to the past and current status of the official Danish Police side arms ?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
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    Denmark
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    Default

    Sorry, besides Bergmann 1910/21 I don't know much about pistols - specially not police pistols..

    Regards
    Niels
    If guns are outlawed - only outlaws have guns...

  4. #4
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  5. #5
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    Default

    Up through the 20th century, the Rigspoliti have used quite an assortment of handguns. The ones that I am aware of are; FN Browning Model 1922, FN Browning Hi-Power, Walther PP, Husqvarna M/40, SIG M/49 and there were probably others. I do not know how long the pistol was in service but the Walther PPK was replaced in 2000 by and Heckler & Koch. I do not know when the Rigspoliti started stamping the pistols with "RPLT", but some pistols did not receive the stamp, but can be identified as police issue from the serial number.

    Forgot to add, the Danish police have been required to carry sidearms since 1965.
    kriggevær - skarpskytte, samler, jæger
    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."

  6. #6
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  7. #7
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    This is a Danish (some of it in english) online debate of past and present Danish Police side arms, which among others claim that the above mentioned Danish Police museum has a copy of every handgun ever used by the Danish Police Forces.

    The list does include the French pistol, "MAB Model C 1933".

    You might need to register to this Danish firearms discussions website: "Nordisk Vaabenforum", which also in this particular debate mentions a number of handguns used by the Danish Police.

    http://www.nordisk-forum.dk/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=15268

    This is the link to the reasons for why the Danish Police, in 1965 decided to be armed. Hope you can translate this story to English:

    http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palle_S%C3%B8rensen

    This is the story of the multiple police killer, Palle Soerensen, who on September 18, 1965, in two separate incidents, in cold blood gunned down four, unarmed Danish Police officers, using 15 rounds, in which 12 bullets struck the victims. He then turned himself in to police three days later and confessed the murders. He served 32 years and eight months for his crimes, and was 71 years old when released, ands thus became the longest serving inmate in the modern history of Denmark, as well as prompting the Danish Police to be armed with side arms, from the very next day after his deadly crimes.
    Last edited by snowhunter; 10-24-2010 at 10:09 PM.

  8. #8
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    Default

    Thanks for all the help. You've given me some good starting places and significant information to continue researching this.

    Thanks again.

    Bill

  9. #9
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    Dec 1969
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    Siskiyou County, California
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gun_Shy View Post
    My apologies for posting a quesiton here that is not about Krag rifles.

    No problem with this topic in this forum. The rules of this forum were deliberately left more easy going to include firearms such as Danish rolling blocks.

    The markings certainly look like those found on Swedish m/40 Lahti pistols that went to Denmark for police use. I'm surprised nobody has brought forth a definitive answer for you.

    Dutchman

  10. #10
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    After searching the internet, with interest for informations about Danish Police side arms, both in the Danish and the English languages, but however, due to the scarcity of informations on the internet in regards to past and present Danish Police weapons, I have come to the conclusions that the best source for informations in regards to this interesting and little known subject, is to contact the above mentioned Danish Police Museum ?

    I am surprised that the Danish Police also used the Lathi pistol. I know that the Danish Police, in emergency situations, like when seaching for the quadruple police killer in 1965, would carry the Madsen submachine as well, which now appears to have been replaced by the German HK submachine gun. I only knew that after WW2, the Danish Armed Forces were issued the Lathi pistol.

  11. #11
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    Default

    A few days ago I emailed the Danish Police Museum asking about the police use of MAB pistols and these markings, and will let you know the response.

    Bill

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