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  1. #1
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    Default Buying a Crate full of 91/30 Mosins

    I'm just toying with the idea of buying a shipping crate of Mosins. Several questions though.....how many in a crate? Do the bayonets, other accessories come in the crate? Are the wooden crates unsearched when received by the final buyer? Are they all 91/30's or other types (M44's, 38's, etc) possibly included? Have any dealers listed prices for a crate of Mosins?

    I've looked at a couple of recently opened Mosin crates and seen both round and hex receivers, some ex-dragoons, one czarist era rifle, just a neat variety to cherry pick through. To me it wouldn't be worth while if the crate has been picked through previously. Have any of the members bought a crate?

  2. #2
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    I have had the pleasure of rooting through a total of 4 crates at a local shop. If the crates are untouched from the distributor, they will have 20 91/30s, one bayonet, cleaning kit, cleaning pouch, sling, oiler and two double ammo pouches per rifle.
    The rifles will be in the top section and the accessories will be wrapped in wax paper in the bottom. COSMOLINE CITY on the accessories.
    PW arms is the importer that these 4 crates came from--they were all hex receivers and some even had matching bayonets.
    Freedom is far from free. Thank a U.S. Veteran.

  3. #3
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    1) I am probably wrong, but I think a crate of of Model 1891-1930 Rifles hold 20 rifles. Crate of Model 1938 Carbines hold 10 rifles.
    2) All the accessories should be included, that is the way they come in from Europe. If the accessories are missing, it is importer and seller's fault.
    3) All the crates are unsealed and importer information is applied to each rifle.
    4) If you can find a seller that has variety of models in quantity in stock (Model 1891-1930, Model 1938, Mode 1944), you can ask them to make an assortment crate for you. Also keep in mind that since the carbines are shorter then rifles, if you use rifle crate, the carbines will get knocked around some. And, naturally, rifles will not fit into crate made for carbines. Much safer to buy a crate of one variety of rifle.

  4. #4
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    A friend bought a crate of 20 91/30s. All of them were nice refurbs, no hexes. Earliest date was 1937, no ex dragoons or ex snipers or anything out of the ordinary. Nice wood, nice accessories... no matching bayonets. It was fun!

  5. #5
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    I would contact RGuns (A Gunboards Sponsor) as the crates I've seen from them are ecxellent !
    Vigilance in Living counteracts Stupidity in Dying
    Per Scintillam Flamma

  6. #6
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    I think a crate of mosin nagants would make an sweet coffee table

  7. #7
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    I've seen crates from ATI and PW Arms. Both had a mix of hex/round rifles. However, it's not uncommon for some places to sort them into crates that are ONLY hex or round, with a price difference, of course.

    John

  8. #8
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    I have often wondered what I'd get if I bought a full crate. Could be an interesting 'treasure' hunt.

  9. #9
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    We have toyed with the idea also, would be sweet to dive into an unsearched crate.


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  10. #10
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    A crate! You guys have all the fun!

  11. #11
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    A crate of parts rifles! OK if that is what turns you on quantity versus quality. One nice Chatellerault in pristine after war Finn refurbishment has more effect on me, especially at $200. To each their own I guess! Bill
    zeebill live from the hills of West Virginia!

  12. #12
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    I didnt buy a crate full, I just filled a couple of crates ...
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by zeebill View Post
    A crate of parts rifles! OK if that is what turns you on quantity versus quality. One nice Chatellerault in pristine after war Finn refurbishment has more effect on me, especially at $200. To each their own I guess! Bill
    My Austrian captured, finn marked (not finned otherwise) Chatellerault, in very worn condition has the effect on me. I sold all my refurbs. They just don't speak to me. A crate would still be cool though.

  14. #14
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    I'm with zeebill,
    Why not buy a empty crate and then buy what you want and put in it. Even if it is a little more, its certainly worth it.

    Dolk
    "Quando omni flunkus moritati"
    when all else fails play dead

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by dolk View Post
    I'm with zeebill,
    Why not buy a empty crate and then buy what you want and put in it. Even if it is a little more, its certainly worth it.

    Dolk
    +1, still looking for one myself...I want a really nice home for my dragoons and Finn'd 91/30's.

  16. #16
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    I bought 2 crates of Mosins once - 20 rifles, 10 to a crate. Crates are WW2 German made - identical to a WW2 German 98k crate, only a few inches longer. 17 of the rifles were 1944 Izhevsk, 2 were 1943 Izhevsk, and 1 was a '39 Tula.

    I think that with the cost of the rifles and shipping for them and the crates, it cost me under $6,000. So it was a pretty good deal all the way around.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
    I bought 2 crates of Mosins once - 20 rifles, 10 to a crate. Crates are WW2 German made - identical to a WW2 German 98k crate, only a few inches longer. 17 of the rifles were 1944 Izhevsk, 2 were 1943 Izhevsk, and 1 was a '39 Tula.

    I think that with the cost of the rifles and shipping for them and the crates, it cost me under $6,000. So it was a pretty good deal all the way around.
    6 thousand bucks? I have a couple I will sell you for 400. I realize its a misprint.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by sniperfreak View Post
    +1, still looking for one myself...I want a really nice home for my dragoons and Finn'd 91/30's.
    I finallly found one locally after years of trying to come across one in the wild since no one will ship just a crate due to the size. I went with a simple stand to put in against the wall since the "mancave" is not large enough for the coffee table style.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails mosin crate after.jpg   mosin crate before.jpg  

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucko View Post
    I finallly found one locally after years of trying to come across one in the wild since no one will ship just a crate due to the size. I went with a simple stand to put in against the wall since the "mancave" is not large enough for the coffee table style.
    I like this idea....making a stand. I'm working on filling a crate now. Just got a couple more to go.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by mto7464 View Post
    6 thousand bucks? I have a couple I will sell you for 400. I realize its a misprint.
    No misprint. These were Yugo issue PU snipers. In rare WW2 German made and Yugo captured 91/30 sniper crates.
    Last edited by Marcus; 03-31-2011 at 03:09 PM.

  21. #21
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    who sells crates of mosins?..id pop for one

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blahman View Post
    I like this idea....making a stand. I'm working on filling a crate now. Just got a couple more to go.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucko View Post
    I finallly found one locally after years of trying to come across one in the wild since no one will ship just a crate due to the size. I went with a simple stand to put in against the wall since the "mancave" is not large enough for the coffee table style.
    I just used kd 2x4's and pine for the shelf to match the crate style. I pulled the lower rear metal "L" bracket and had home depot color match it. I also routered out a channel for the lower wood piece that protrudes from the bottom so they lock into the tops when they are stacked. I made the cut so the crate would sit flush on the base.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucko View Post
    I just used kd 2x4's and pine for the shelf to match the crate style. I pulled the lower rear metal "L" bracket and had home depot color match it. I also routered out a channel for the lower wood piece that protrudes from the bottom so they lock into the tops when they are stacked. I made the cut so the crate would sit flush on the base.
    That is cool.....picking up the 2x4's and I'm gonna do it....

  24. #24
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    Just received an email from Classic Arms, they will sell you an unsearched crate of twenty 91/30's for $1500, ($75 apiece). Classic states that each crate lists by serial # each of the guns that are in a crate, nothing cherry picked or replaced. Matching #'ed bayonets and accessories are included. Now I know this is overkill on buying Mosins, but it's kind of neat to imagine treasure hunting through an original shipping case of refurbished 91/30s. To really be practical you would need an 01 FFL to sell off the ordinary Mosins and keep the unique ones. Classic says they have sold several crates this way, just call their phone number and ask for "a Mosin crate deal".

    I didn't call Classic Arms about a crate of Mosins, they just threw this item out with their weekly specials.

  25. #25
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    ZeeBill is on the money in my opinion. Either buy some really choice rifle for same money or buy a crate and then
    go hand select 20 great weapons to put in it.

    If you got to buy in the blind, why not buy from R Guns or another sponsor ?

    Classic can say what they want but my money is they check and pull any jewels out and put a dog in its place. Doubt
    you will find SA or sniper marked weapons and doubt you will find best quality grade either.

    And for the few who have done this crate purchase: how many truthfully admitted they got hosed ?????




  26. #26
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    You're right about buying Mosin crates, it's worth a few dollars more to select each individual rifle than to buy a case of unknowns. This is the first time I've seen a crate advertised and the price didn't seem too far out of line. An ideal situation is to be where a dealer opens a crate and allows you to select the ones of interest to you.

  27. #27
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    Sounds like fun!
    I have a Yugo SKS crate that I keep mag pouches, etc. in...in the garage.
    I thought about the coffee table thing but I'll need to build a clubhouse first.


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  28. #28
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    On the subjects of crates, I do not know if the invoice or shipping manifest is fastened to the lid of the crate. That would certainly
    assure a buyer he is buying a crate as shipped (which seems to have a certain ambiance for many of you). I don't know the answer.

    However, having inventoried a few hundred Polish crates of AKM in Iraq, the manifest was on that inside top lid, weapons were all matching numbers
    and bayonets were number matched to the weapons. Mag pouches, slings, oil tins, mags and tool kits were in wax paper lining the bottom
    of the crate. From what I have seen of Mosin crates at USA gun shows full of weapons, the packing of rifles seems to be the same way with
    accessories lining the bottom of crate.

    Of course be it AK or Mosin: lathered in a inch of cosmolene over all metal parts.

    Maybe Mosin crates have manifests ? If so, that would be something to ask about when buying a crate.

  29. #29
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    In their ad Classic mentions that each rifle is listed by the importer's serial number on the inventory sheet fastened to the crate. I haven't seen the "Mosin crate deal" on Classic's website, it should be posted soon. They send these promo specials out if you're on their email list before listing on their website.

  30. #30
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    Whatever you do, get the Soviet packing list.

    If Classic is including American packing list, it would have been made by importer, pretty worthless in my opinion.

  31. #31

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    I've seen them from Century before. They have a white sheet on them with rifle SN and date on them. From the two I saw they were all round receivers. The sheets were from the importer annotating they had serialized the box contents.

  32. #32
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    Classic can say what they want but my money is they check and pull any jewels out and put a dog in its place. Doubt you will find SA or sniper marked weapons and doubt you will find best quality grade either.
    First of all milprelib, I'm not sure why anyone would expect an SA stamped rifle in a crate of Mosins from the Ukraine.

    Since the sniper/ ex sniper 91/30's were kept separate in the armory's from the standard infantry 91/30's & the importers have always sorted them anyway & charged a higher price, I'm not sure why someone would expect to find one either, in these rifles.

    However, I do have a type 01 FFL and I have also done quite a bit of business w/ Classic Arms; and found them to be quite honest. They will even take back Century crap that is not up to par/ over graded/ missing parts/ or non functional and will even send a call tag for it and either give you a refund or store credit for it; something that AIM refused to do for a large lot of Enfield 2A's we purchased from them advertised as 'Good to Very good condition' which would rate actually 'Poor to Fair' condition; missing parts, cracked stocks, missing magazine, etc. etc. etc....Some of them genuinely appeared to have been dragged behind a truck on some gravel road in India. We had to pay return shipping to AIM; after having to take photos of the crap they sent us & email it to their rep. to prove it was crap; and go through an absolute hassle with them, just to get their permission for a return. They were very rude, to boot...We will not do business with AIM any more as a result. This was problem #3 with them.

    The first issue w/ AIM 3 years previous was 3 Century Romanian AK's out of a shipment of 10. Of those 3, one did not have a gas port drilled & would not function. The other two, one had badly canted gas block, 2nd had badly canted RSB. We had to pay to ship them back. They then replaced them w/ some better ones, but they had canted FSB's.

    The second issue we had with them, a year before the Enfield deal we bought 10 Walther P1 West German Police trade in's from them. They shipped the wrong holsters w/ the pistols (beat up black leather police holsters), they made us pay to ship the holsters back and then they shipped us the correct new issue West German military Flecktarn holsters as originally advertised & promised to us over the phone when we first placed the order.

    Sure, AIM used to have some good stuff. We bought a lot of it from them. But if you happen to get bad stuff or the wrong stuff they act like they are not accountable for it and like it's your problem. Plus, the rudeness of their reps in customer service does not help at all...This, after spending thousands with the bums. This is not how you build good customer relationships with dealers you distribute to. Of course all this went down between 5-10 years ago, perhaps they have changed, but I seriously doubt it, unless they have changed ownership. I really don't believe AIM caters to dealers anymore anyway; all their stuff seems to be pretty much priced on their site @ 'suggested retail' or barely under it now.

    So, before you start bashing Classic Arms, Milprileb, let's here about all the problems you have had with them and how they screwed you over?

    Sure, Classic is a little higher than the real big outfits, but they are easy to deal with, fair and honest...They say they have a mix of round, hex and even some ex Dragoons in their crates of Mosins; I believe them as I have seen them for sale on their site after they have been sorted from the same crates.

    I look at their site every week and order a good bit of stuff from them... They don't strike me as the sort of people who would pull a 'Gem' & replace it w/ a 'Dog'.

    Sure, they may not be a site sponsor, but that's no reason to call them dishonest.

    I mean really. Let's get real here.
    Last edited by Mr Polytech; 05-17-2011 at 03:48 AM.
    Locatian: BFE Montana.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Polytech View Post
    First of all milprelib, I'm not sure why anyone would expect an SA stamped rifle in a crate of Mosins from the Ukraine.

    Since the sniper/ ex sniper 91/30's were kept separate in the armory's from the standard infantry 91/30's & the importers have always sorted them anyway & charged a higher price, I'm not sure why someone would expect to find one either, in these rifles.

    However, I do have a type 01 FFL and I have also done quite a bit of business w/ Classic Arms; and found them to be quite honest. They will even take back Century crap that is not up to par/ over graded/ missing parts/ or non functional and will even send a call tag for it and either give you a refund or store credit for it; something that AIM refused to do for a large lot of Enfield 2A's we purchased from them advertised as 'Good to Very good condition' which would rate actually 'Poor to Fair' condition; missing parts, cracked stocks, missing magazine, etc. etc. etc....Some of them genuinely appeared to have been dragged behind a truck on some gravel road in India. We had to pay return shipping to AIM; after having to take photos of the crap they sent us & email it to their rep. to prove it was crap; and go through an absolute hassle with them, just to get their permission for a return. They were very rude, to boot...We will not do business with AIM any more as a result. This was problem #3 with them.

    The first issue w/ AIM 3 years previous was 3 Century Romanian AK's out of a shipment of 10. Of those 3, one did not have a gas port drilled & would not function. The other two, one had badly canted gas block, 2nd had badly canted RSB. We had to pay to ship them back. They then replaced them w/ some better ones, but they had canted FSB's.

    The second issue we had with them, a year before the Enfield deal we bought 10 Walther P1 West German Police trade in's from them. They shipped the wrong holsters w/ the pistols (beat up black leather police holsters), they made us pay to ship the holsters back and then they shipped us the correct new issue West German military Flecktarn holsters as originally advertised & promised to us over the phone when we first placed the order.

    Sure, AIM used to have some good stuff. We bought a lot of it from them. But if you happen to get bad stuff or the wrong stuff they act like they are not accountable for it and like it's your problem. Plus, the rudeness of their reps in customer service does not help at all...This, after spending thousands with the bums. This is not how you build good customer relationships with dealers you distribute to. Of course all this went down between 5-10 years ago, perhaps they have changed, but I seriously doubt it, unless they have changed ownership. I really don't believe AIM caters to dealers anymore anyway; all their stuff seems to be pretty much priced on their site @ 'suggested retail' or barely under it now.

    So, before you start bashing Classic Arms, Milprileb, let's here about all the problems you have had with them and how they screwed you over?

    Sure, Classic is a little higher than the real big outfits, but they are easy to deal with, fair and honest...They say they have a mix of round, hex and even some ex Dragoons in their crates of Mosins; I believe them as I have seen them for sale on their site after they have been sorted from the same crates.

    I look at their site every week and order a good bit of stuff from them... They don't strike me as the sort of people who would pull a 'Gem' & replace it w/ a 'Dog'.

    Sure, they may not be a site sponsor, but that's no reason to call them dishonest.

    I mean really. Let's get real here.
    To me, this seems like you're venting more of a beef with AIM than with milprileb. WOw!

    I don't know a lot about Classic, other than most of the people who have ordered from them have had good reviews, spare a few who were absolutely disgusted, so I guess that's a draw and anyone who knows anything about business will realize that not every company, is going to satisfy every customer, every time. What I do know, however, is that Classic, more than pretty much any other outfit I've seen, gets pretty specific with the type of Mosin rifle you can buy from them and they price them accordingly. Where most places (like AIM) keep it at simply "Hex vs. Round", Classic will give you pretty much every possible combination of options within that FOR A HIGHER PRICE. Where do you think they get them from, anyway????

    As for this statement:

    Since the sniper/ ex sniper 91/30's were kept separate in the armory's from the standard infantry 91/30's & the importers have always sorted them anyway & charged a higher price, I'm not sure why someone would expect to find one either, in these rifles.
    That is not true, at all. The only importer that I know of that has separated the ex-snipers out from the rest of the rifles, is RGuns. Furthermore, that's the whole thing about hunting for ex-snipers. They're almost always mixed in with the regular rifles at the SAME price. That's what makes it fun and rewarding to hunt through them. Also, there's a reason they are "ex" snipers. It's because they were returned back to REGULAR status and mixed back in with all the REGULAR rifles. Why the hell would the Russians, or Ukrainians keep them separate at that point? The didn't! (ETA: The same thing can be said for Tulas, ex-dragoons, laminate stocks, etc. To the Russians, they were all 91/30s. Period)

    In addition to this, there's a thing called a "re-capture". I would suggest you look it up, as several members have post-war refurbished rifles, which were originally Russian made, have SA marks. How do you suppose that happens?

    If you've got a beef with AIM, take it up with them, or save it for the appropriate thread.

    John
    Last edited by Joop; 05-17-2011 at 09:01 AM. Reason: typos

  34. #34
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    Several folks have found [SA] marked recapture rifles in regular crates of Mosins. Plus MO rifles, former snipers, and other odd balls. But odds are in an average crate, you will only find a MO or former sniper.

    Like buying a pack of baseball cards. How many packs do you have to buy to get a good card? Better to root through other people's crates for good stuff. I've looked through something like 20 crates and only seen MO or former snipers. That $1500-2000 is better spent on individual rifles than 20 very average rifles that will only be worth what you pay for them.
    "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever."
    -David St.Hubbins

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Homer2 View Post
    Several folks have found [SA] marked recapture rifles in regular crates of Mosins. Plus MO rifles, former snipers, and other odd balls. But odds are in an average crate, you will only find a MO or former sniper.

    Like buying a pack of baseball cards. How many packs do you have to buy to get a good card? Better to root through other people's crates for good stuff. I've looked through something like 20 crates and only seen MO or former snipers. That $1500-2000 is better spent on individual rifles than 20 very average rifles that will only be worth what you pay for them.
    Exactly!

    And, if I were buying baseball cards from the kid down the street, I wouldn't be paying him anywhere near the price I could get them for at the local drug store, especially when the packages have already been opened and I know he's got all the best players for sale on Ebay.

    John

  36. #36
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    Many of you may not know this either, is that AIM orders their crates of 91/30's from RGuns pre-picked by RGuns for anything that is exceptional to the standard Hex or Round version. If it's an ex-dragoon, Roger pulls it out. If it is standard outside of the normal Hex or Round, Roger pulls it out. That's the way it is.

    And I agree, it sounds like you have a problem with AIM. Which is fine, everyone has their own opinions and their own experiences and no business in infallible to mistakes, but this is not the Forum to do a customer review on.
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  37. #37
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    I've bought crates of MN's from I/O & Classic. I've even bought as many as 100 at a pop from CAI. I have never got a Finn anything 'mixed up' in the crates - okay once I thought that Classic had accidentally sent me a sniper rifle with my order. I was in shock really until I looked at the invoice and realized I actually ordered the sniper rifle.. You roll the dice and you take your chances. If I were a collector I would not waste my time buying 20 at a pop?

    As an 01 FFL buying en masse is the way to go. Until recently when I bought MN's by the crate there was a little bit of everything in there. Hex's, round receivers, ex snipers, etc. Recently though several of the big guys have told me that as of right now the only thing coming in from overseas are crates of round receivers. So be it. I buy in bulk knowing that worse case scenario I get what I pay for (20 round receiver MN's). Anything extra is just gravy...

  38. #38
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    Default Negative dealer post

    The negative posting about dealers has no place on this forum.If you have a gripe about dealers we have a place to vent.It is the Traider-buyer negative seller feedback forum.Please use it.
    WLD Bill

  39. #39

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    Just another opinion. I've had nothing but great experience with AIM.

  40. #40

    Default

    +1 with Joop and DOGolden. But.....just to stir the pot and get this thread back on track. I just ordered an unopened crate from Classic. They were great and answered all of my questions. To back up what DOGolden stated, they ordered several crates of Hex and instead received all rounds. The folks overseas told them they hadn't specified Hex receivers specifically on the order form. So, they have a plethura of round receivers. They did say that the 3-4 crates they've opened and inventoried are all equal to what was coming over 6 or so years ago. She said they were all in excellent condition, bores were VG+, markings were not buffed off and all bayonets match. $75 a rifle, crate was free, $250 shipping from NC to Kansas. Brings Grand total to $87.50 per rifle. We'll see how they come out and if I got a deal or just had a fun experience. At least I'll have tons of trading stock!!

    I'll report when I get it and what I received.

    Cheers!
    Brian

  41. #41
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    684

    Default

    Looking forward to what you receive. Please post several pictures of what you find when first opening the crate and what the inventory consists of.

  42. #42
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Michigan, USA
    Posts
    16,341

    Thumbs down

    As stated by some other mods keep this on topic or I'll can it.
    Owner/Administrator of Gunboards.com
    Mosin Nagant.net
    Michigan Historical Collectables

    "Tulta munille!"

    "Terror is not a new weapon. Throughout history it has been used by those who could not prevail, either by persuasion or example. But inevitably they fail, either because men are not afraid to die for a life worth living, or because the terrorists themselves came to realize that free men cannot be frightened by threats, and that aggression would meet its own response. And it is in the light of that history that every nation today should know, be he friend or foe, that the United States has both the will and the weapons to join free men in standing up to their responsibilities."
    John F. Kennedy

  43. #43

    Default

    Crate shipped yesterday! Classic Arms was fantastic. Original shipper tried to add $130 to the delivery charge "for home delivery". As if that was differant than business delivery. They stated it was due to not having a loading dock. Not sure about you, but how many businesses let alone gun shops have loading docks? Anyway, they jumped through many hoops and got UPS to delivery it for the original quote. I really like these folks!! Will post photos when it arrives as I open it.

    Cheers,
    Brian

  44. #44
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    outside the box, in the grey area
    Posts
    7,807

    Default

    the ups guy is gonna hate you, I ordered a crate from Gregg at mg34, early 2000, shipped by frieght truck, to where I was working at the time, we used a front end loader to get it off the truck, if memory serve's the crate weighed 280 or 300 lbs. getting it in the house was another story, I put the crate on 3 inch wheels that was a good idea, easy to move, the mosins in the crate have been the nicest I have seen in the last 10 years, mostly 43 44.

  45. #45
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    684

    Default

    The crates are heavy, 20 rifles with accessories, about 10+ pounds apiece plus the crate will be pushing 300 lbs. Get about 3 strong buds, couple of six packs and you should be set. Your buddies will wanna see what you got so have plenty of paper towels. Take plenty of pics!!

    Lookin' forward to seeing what you got!!

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