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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    16

    Default Japanese Arisaka in .30-06, Pictures up!

    Hi all,

    I just bought a strange Japanese Rifle in .30-06, I don't know much about it and thought there might be a few here who have more knowledge.

    Description:

    - It looks like a shortend Type 38 rifle, but not as short as a Type 38 carbine.
    -It also has what looks like an M1 Carbine front sight protector,
    -Has a dust cover and cleaning rod, web sling.
    Any information would be greatly apreciated.


    Click image for larger version. 

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    Also, I'll have picture posted as soon as I can.
    Last edited by bryan22; 06-03-2011 at 10:00 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Spanaway, WA
    Posts
    439

    Default

    As a non-expert, my first impression is that you have one that Bubba sporterized because there was no ammo available for it and he wanted a hunting rifle cheap. Re-barreling and re-chambering for 30-06 is a logical move. The action should be strong enough to handle the round. I would, however, run it by a gunsmith to make sure that Bubba had a clue what he was doing before you try to fire it.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    3,154

    Default

    Sounds like one of the Thai army conversions.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Spanaway, WA
    Posts
    439

    Default

    There would be some additional proof markings if it the Thai conversion, right? The mum would be deleted or altered.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    1,431

    Default

    The Thais boldly marked the barrel chamber top with several of thier characters indicated its designation and a date. If you post pictures of this area I can tell you for sure. Also they cut a U-shaped wedge out of the front of the receiver so the cartridges could be loaded with a clip and fit directly over the magazine box.

    Frank
    Francis C. Allan
    20 Courtney Place
    Palm Coast, FL 32137-8126
    (386) 445-4225

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    16

    Default

    Okay great, thanks for the help guys!!, I'll have the pictures as soon as I figure out how to post.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    3,154

    Default

    Hey Frank, did they alter or lengthen the magazine box and floorplate for 30.06? I have one of the Finn T38s in 7.92 and found it will load reliably only without the magazine box.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    16

    Default

    It is the same as the one in the picture but has the sling and wood is a lighter color.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    5,055

    Default

    I have several of these, and although very well converted, most have Chamber Issues...leading to rapid head separation with New .30/06 brass or fully resized ex-mil brass. (chamber too deep, NOT bolt setback, as New Rifles were used)

    Size your .30 brass to just fit the chamber, then load with an 80% .30cal load.

    Done in the 1960s, at about the same time as they converted a lot of brand new Nagoya T38s to the same size--DP Trainers (nipped the FP, bent the bolt handle over, to "Lock" the bolt closed, and Pinned the magazine release button to stop loss of Floor Plate. The DPs are usually found with cracked stocks at the wrist ( used to heave guys over walls!!!) The DPs are still in 6,5x50SR.
    The .30 cal rifles are scrubbed and re-crested, the DP trainers are as is (Cancelled Mum only)
    regards,
    Doc AV
    AV Ballistics.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    16

    Default

    Thanks for the information. Does this mean it is a Thailand/Siamese issued rifle?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Posts
    13,998

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bryan22 View Post
    Thanks for the information. Does this mean it is a Thailand/Siamese issued rifle?
    Post a picture of the top of the receiver so we can tell.
    03man - Don Voigt
    Author of "The Japanese T99 Arisaka Rifle" 2010 edition
    Co-author of "The Knee Mortars of Japan 1921-1945" 2011 edition
    Near Charlotte, NC

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    16

    Default

    Post a picture of the top of the receiver so we can tell.
    Okay, I'll take a few and get some posted asap.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    1,431

    Default

    The rifle is definately a Thai Type 83/88. That is, a Thai Type 83 (a la Japanese Type 38) converted to fire the Thai Type 88 cartridge (.30-06/ US .30 cal). The barrel step on the shortened barrel is most likely stamped ๘ ๓ / ๒ ๕ ๐ ๒ - 83/2502 or Type 83 modified in the Buddhist year 2502 (Gregorian calendar 1959). Even in a general photo the front sight guards added by the Thais are the give away.

    This subject is covered in the "Type 38 Arisaka" in chapter XII.

    Your rifle has a straight bolt handle. Many had the handles turned down and I thought all had that feature, but several have been reported since the book was published with matching straignt bolt handles.

    When you get a minute could you send me the serial number and series (25th or 27th) as I am keeping track of additional reports of these rifles to try to get a better handle on how many were converted.

    Thanks.

    Frank
    Francis C. Allan
    20 Courtney Place
    Palm Coast, FL 32137-8126
    (386) 445-4225

  14. #14
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    16

    Default

    Okay, I have taken some pictures om the actual rifle, If anyone would like to see pictures, please send me your email, and I'll send a few. I can't figure out how to post them here, if someone can do it for me that would be great. I just got it in the mail and it's a lot nicer than I thought. Rifling is mint. I actually bought it for hunting, Liked the way it looked. It kind of reminded me of a K98 mauser.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    1,431

    Default

    Dear CW;

    The Thais really went to town on the modifications. They cut a U-shaped wedge out of the receiver face and then also cut the clip guide back also, both to accomodate the longer cartridge. They also lengthened the magazine box, added a recoil bolt, shortened most to short rifle length and put tapered guards around the front sight. I am not sure about the follower. I'll have to check that later. The U.S. gave the Thais .30 ammo loading machinery and helped them set them up.

    Frank
    Francis C. Allan
    20 Courtney Place
    Palm Coast, FL 32137-8126
    (386) 445-4225

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