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  1. #1
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    Default Development, Usage, and Collecting the Chinese T-53 Mosin Nagant

    I have recently developed an interest in Mosins that were developed for usage in conjunction with the The People's Republic of China portion of the Cold War Era...(Korea, Vietnam, etc.)

    ...Unfortunately, I haven't found much info on the various Mosin Nagant websites about the T-53 (already been on MosinNagant.net and 7.62x554r.net and got what I could there)...but...am coming up a little light in the information and photograph department...specifically, I am interested in the development and wartime usage of this particular Mosin carbine...and how those things affect the COLLECTIBILITY of this firearm...

    Can any of you seasoned veteran gunboarders please direct me to an older thread on GB to learn from, if there is one??...I have seen a few pics on here of some of the "bring backs" (VERRRRRRY cool, btw)...and that has given me a wealth of new info...but, can anyone shed any OTHER light on the usage of these guns??...

    I do understand that much of the Cold War Era is shrouded in secrecy and mystery, and with the collapse of the Soviet Union, this shroud is slowly lifting...and, I also realize that the PRC's military information is impossible or, at the very least, hard to come by...but, some of you guys have been around these firearms for awhile...so...I figured this was the place to go for answers...

    For instance, is it common to see these guns with mismatched parts? matched parts? force-matched parts?...was there field exchange of parts?...what is the refurb. history (if any) of the T-53?...any idea of arsenal information and production numbers?...any other interesting collector info that makes these carbines worth more or less?...

    ...ANY info at all would be greatly appreciated!!!

    and, Mods...if this is OT, and you know of an old thread that I can glean info from without having to start this new one...please let me know...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  2. #2
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    Default

    Incidentally, THIS is a great little link for those of you who ALSO want to upgrade your knowledge of the Chinese Type 53 Mosin!!...ALOT of info packed into a small space!!:

    http://www.mosinnagant.net/global mo...T53Carbine.asp

    ...and THESE are just a FEW of the threads I found on this forum:

    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...s-worth-425.00

    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...-a-Chinese-M44

    ...and THIS is one of the COOLEST posts on the T-53 that I have seen so far:

    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...mented-history

    I am just looking for some MORE info that might be out there...and any NEW info that's popped up recently...
    Last edited by themosinator; 07-15-2011 at 06:35 PM. Reason: added extra links
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  3. #3
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    Default

    A few pics of three Type 53 rifles .

    this is a older Navy Arms rifle which was not import stamped. It's been through a arsenal refinish, however is still all stamped matching. I really like the gough milling marks on the top rear of the stock.










    This rifle is all original stamped matching and not refinished. No import marks either.








    Early Type 53 All stamped matching no import marks. Still packed with grease.










    Scans of a Navy Arms sales flier from the 1980's showing the Chinese Type 53's The cost for a like new Type 53 (as in the top photos) was $105

    I never met a gun I didn't like!
    Dogs are better people than most people.

  4. #4

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    Those are crazy nice T53's JIMMY C! I don't think I've ever seen a Type 53 in person with that much finish left on it, ha!

  5. #5
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    Those are excellent and informative pics, JIMMYC!!...thanks!!...any idea as to where the arsenal refurb. occurred and who did it??...was it like the Soviet refurbs. that came from and then ended back up in Izhevsk?...so did the Chinese T53s go back to the arsenal in Chongqing?...was it like the Czech or Yugo or Ukraine deal with refurbs.??...AKA, did the PRC take guns out of service, and back to mainland China to other areas to be refurb'd?...

    just curious...not much out there...in terms of available info compared with other Mosins...

    ...incidentally...did anyone notice the M28 in that old Navy Arms add above??...how much (or how little) did they go for back then??...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  6. #6
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    I guess one of the things I am wondering is...did the T-53 ever get used in battle, and then get sent back to the arsenal?...or did they just end up in country, and occasionally get brought back by veterans?...I notice alot of T-53s seem like they did some time in the field (pretty beat up stocks)...whereas others (see above) look like they may have never even been shot before?...

    Any other T-53 collectors out there?...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  7. #7

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    I have a 1960 Chicom T53. It is just about the sorriest looking gun I've ever seen. This thing had to seen action in SE Asia at one time or another. Heavy pitting and rust all over the thing. Internally it is immaculate though, bore is like a mirror and the trigger is exceptionally good.

    When I get around to it, its getting an extended dip into kroil to try to get the rust out of the pitting.

  8. #8
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    I've got an all matching one from 1955.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by themosinator View Post
    Those are excellent and informative pics, JIMMYC!!...thanks!!...any idea as to where the arsenal refurb. occurred and who did it??...was it like the Soviet refurbs. that came from and then ended back up in Izhevsk?...so did the Chinese T53s go back to the arsenal in Chongqing?...was it like the Czech or Yugo or Ukraine deal with refurbs.??...AKA, did the PRC take guns out of service, and back to mainland China to other areas to be refurb'd?...

    just curious...not much out there...in terms of available info compared with other Mosins...

    ...incidentally...did anyone notice the M28 in that old Navy Arms add above??...how much (or how little) did they go for back then??...
    So, I have done some searching via the internet, this forum, and the various Mosin-oriented sites...and...am still coming up empty handed in terms of usable information on the Chinese Type 53...is anyone on this forum our local expert on the Type 53?...it seems that there should be more folks on this forum who either own, have owned, have seen, or know something about this evidently enigmatic carbine!!...

    ...I have checked through the various threads, and have only found a handful of threads on the Type 53...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  10. #10
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    ANY help on this subject AT ALL, would be GREATLY appreciated!!...more pics of more Type 53s would be GREATLY appreciated!!...

    Thanks!!
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  11. #11
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    Heres my one and only Type 53. Navy Arms import 1955 dated. Its all matching with the exception of the bolt. I think its a little bit interesting as it has a Remington made bolt body and i'm not completly sure but I think the stock is Soviet due to the light CCCP stamping on the stock. I don't think the bolt was put in when it entered the U.S. because judging by the amount of grease/dirt/grime evenly caked all over the entire rifle when I bought it had been with it for a long time. The serial number on the bolt looks like it could have been scrubbed and renumbered also at sometime but i'm not sure. Overall the rifle looks like it has certainly been used but there is only light finish wear, there isn't one spot of pitting and the bore is near perfect. Hope this helps
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DSCN1250.jpg   DSCN1256.jpg   DSCN1252.jpg   DSCN1257.jpg   DSCN1266.jpg   DSCN1259.jpg  


  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buckeyesgt View Post
    I've got an all matching one from 1955.
    Nice!...how does it shoot?...I've read mixed reviews about the Type 53's accuracy!...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  13. #13
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    Can't help you with any of the specifics of the T-53.

    1. Many were used in terrible conditions for a gun and look like they have been dragged behind a truck .

    2. Since many were used in adverse conditions the bores were often not cleaned very well & are corroded, thus accounting for any poor accuracy tales you may have read - Like any gun, if you find a minty T-53 with a sharp shiny bore, it will most likely be as accurate as any M44.

    3. Richard in NY, KH have extensive MN experience, including T-53's, PM one of those two gents some organized questions & they may be able to assist.

    4. Rearsenaled, refurbed, field repaired/modified, simply not issued are all possibilities - Who knows for sure? Some should be mere parts guns, few look brand new.

    5. Quality of manufacture is top notch - On par with Polish M44's etc. It is because many were issued and heavily used(read beat...) is most likely the bad rap one hears at gunshows or reads in the forums, written by the ignorant.

    6. Matching guns are few and far between for used T-53's - Many seem to have mismatched bolts.

    7. The 1960 dated guns are often posted in dandy shape, read new or refurbed. Not to say many 1960 dated guns are all new, many 1960 dated guns are also posted in very very sorry shape.

    I'll post some pic's of my one and only T-53.

    Pahtu.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by themosinator View Post
    Nice!...how does it shoot?...I've read mixed reviews about the Type 53's accuracy!...
    I haven't taken it out yet. Got a range day set for Friday though. Also there is no import stamp.

  15. #15
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    This gun is also not import marked - I get a kick out of folks who correct me and say you just did not see the import mark, or missed it. It is not import stamped. Some folks want to believe such a piece is a soldier bringback, most likely it just missed getting stamped - Generally only believe a piece is a bringback if it has authentic documentation.

    Pahtu.

















    The below pic's shows the use of a Soviet round receiver. 7.62x54r says it is an uncommon feature? I'll take his expertise on that.







    Buttplate does not match the piece.


















  16. #16

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    Wow Pahtu, that's a neat one! I wasn't aware the Chinese used Soviet receivers to build their Type 53's. That's a unique rifle for sure!

  17. #17
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    I did not know it either - According to Ted, it is a rather difficult carbine to find with that receiver - I don't see many of these for sale locally that are not butchered/bubba'd.

    I saw this one at a local show and bought it for 60 bucks.

    Pahtu.

  18. #18
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    Themosinator,

    I'll drop you an email.

    Regards.
    Please, put your imput on the Mosin Nagant sniper rifle database.
    look at:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=21990

    Vz54/57 & 54/91 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...36#post2504436

    Type 53 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...32#post2778832

  19. #19
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    Here are some photos of one from Viet Nam. No papers but no doubt.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails VN Bring Back Type 53 1.JPG   VN Bring Back Type 53 2.JPG   VN Bring Back Type 53 3.JPG   VN Bring Back Type 53 4.JPG   VN Bring Back Type 53 5.JPG   VN Bring Back Type 53 6.JPG  

    VN Bring Back Type 53 7.JPG   VN Bring Back Type 53 8.JPG  

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by geladen View Post
    Here are some photos of one from Viet Nam. No papers but no doubt.
    I agree. Cool rifle.
    Purists of the world, unite!

    “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
    Samuel Adams

  21. #21
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    Here are few pics of my 1955 dated type 53.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Please, put your imput on the Mosin Nagant sniper rifle database.
    look at:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=21990

    Vz54/57 & 54/91 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...36#post2504436

    Type 53 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...32#post2778832

  22. #22
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    This is great!!!...Thanks, guys!!...fantastic photos, and interesting info...what a cool display of guns ranging from near new condition to some really battle-ragged war machines!!!...

    In terms of other info about the T-53...glad to see that it's not just me having a hard time nailing down hardcore facts about these guns, that these carbines so indeed have a somewhat cloudy and murky history in terms of arsenal info, production info, etc., etc.,...

    Hope this thread will help shed more light on this shrouded subject!!!...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  23. #23
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    Columbus, Indiana
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    I am hoping to get member "ryg" to repost a excellent article that he wrote on the Type 53 back in 10/12/2003 that is very helpful in collecting these fine little carbines. The article talks about the various arsenal marks, years of manufacture and quantities of these weapons that were manufactured. I also offered to re type the article on this link if "ryg" is unable to repost, as I saved a hard copy for my personal use. This is the best information I have ever found dealing with the Type 53 and it's production. My friend Albi will be posting some of my Type 53's out of my collection in the near future.

    Bob Hanes "Tex"

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tex View Post
    I am hoping to get member "ryg" to repost a excellent article that he wrote on the Type 53 back in 10/12/2003 that is very helpful in collecting these fine little carbines. The article talks about the various arsenal marks, years of manufacture and quantities of these weapons that were manufactured. I also offered to re type the article on this link if "ryg" is unable to repost, as I saved a hard copy for my personal use. This is the best information I have ever found dealing with the Type 53 and it's production. My friend Albi will be posting some of my Type 53's out of my collection in the near future.

    Bob Hanes "Tex"

    Here are the pics.
    I let Tex describe these wonderful stuff.
    Bob, can you give me a copy of the article you mentioned? I would like to have a copy as an addition to my library..

    Best regards.
    AlbiClick image for larger version. 

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 1.jpg   2.jpg   3.jpg   4.jpg   5.jpg   10.jpg  

    11.jpg   12.jpg   13.jpg  
    Please, put your imput on the Mosin Nagant sniper rifle database.
    look at:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=21990

    Vz54/57 & 54/91 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...36#post2504436

    Type 53 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...32#post2778832

  25. #25
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Please, put your imput on the Mosin Nagant sniper rifle database.
    look at:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=21990

    Vz54/57 & 54/91 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...36#post2504436

    Type 53 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...32#post2778832

  26. #26
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    NOW this thread is goin' somewhere!!!...Great pix, fellas!!...and, yes!!...hope you guys can get that info from "Ryg"...any and all information on the T-53 is important in trying to establish a better understanding of this particular firearm!!...

    Now if only the BATF would hurry up and give me my 03FFL, I could get my T-53 mailed to me!!!...Can't wait to add her to the collection!!...it's getting scary, though...3 guns in 3 months...uh oh...Mosinitis?!?...
    Last edited by themosinator; 07-20-2011 at 03:48 PM.
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tex View Post
    I am hoping to get member "ryg" to repost a excellent article that he wrote on the Type 53 back in 10/12/2003 that is very helpful in collecting these fine little carbines. The article talks about the various arsenal marks, years of manufacture and quantities of these weapons that were manufactured. I also offered to re type the article on this link if "ryg" is unable to repost, as I saved a hard copy for my personal use. This is the best information I have ever found dealing with the Type 53 and it's production. My friend Albi will be posting some of my Type 53's out of my collection in the near future.

    Bob Hanes "Tex"
    REALLY looking forward to this information being posted on this thread!!...I hope it can be made a reality!!...Sounds like a great wealth of information on what is usually a pretty obscure firearm!!

    Thanks to ALL!!
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  28. #28
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    Just got off the phone with "Tex" about the brief paper he has in his possession about the Type 53 carbine. He sent me a copy of it, and checked with the original author ("Ryg") to see if it could be posted here on GB...Evidently, it is okay to post here on GB, so...I am going to do that today...I need to reformat it to put it on here...but, as soon as I do, it'll be here on this thread!!...
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  29. #29
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    And, now by popular demand!!!...The Type 53 paper by "Ryg" courtesy of "Tex"...THANKS, guys!!!


    Chinese Type 53 Carbine

    Arsenal Marks, Production Years & Quantity
    Arsenal 296 mark is reported on guns dated July 1953 to March 1955, and were dated with both the year and month (i.e., 1954.1 = January 1954).

    Those dated 1953 have a serial prefix of “A”, have a small Chinese word right after the serial number, “shi”, meaning “test” or “sample”, and they do not have the Chinese characters showing the model of the gun.

    In January 1954, 4 characters were added showing the model (“5-3-Year-Type”), and the word, “shi”, was dropped. The serial number seems to have restarted at
    1 000 000.

    Sometime in 1955, perhaps April, the arsenal code changed to “26", and other markings changes were made. They now used only 3 characters to show the model (“5-3-Type”), the month was no longer shown, and the serial number re-started at 3 000 000. The “3" in the millionth digit seems to show that it was produced in the 3rd year of production (first year being 1953). This style of numbering is also seen in the Chinese SKS’s from this arsenal.

    1956 were numbered 4 000 000 range, continuing the trend started in 1955.


    There seems to have been no production of Type53's in 1957 - 1959.

    Those dated 1960 show changes in markings. There are no Chinese words for model. The Arsenal code in now 26 in a triangle. The serial numbers consisted of a Roman alphabet letter and 4 digits using a squared font. The serial number is on the buttstock and not on the buttplate. The 1953-56 guns had the serial number on the buttplate, but not on the stock.

    Production

    1953 - Lapin’s book (The Mosin-Nagant Rifle) states production began in May 1953. The earliest number reported, A27xx, is dated July 1953, but it is possible that earlier guns are out there. Highest number for 1953 is A586xx. Estimated total: 59,000.

    1954 - lowest 100053xx (1954.1), highest 12807xx (1954.12). The next number is 13058xx (1955.1) which is about a 20,000 number gap between 1954.12 and 1955.1. I have to arbitrarily assign a number of 1290000 as the cut-off for 1954 for the purposes of this estimate, and say 290,000 were produced for 1954



    1955 - For arsenal 296, lowest reported is #13058xx (1955.1) and the highest 13937xx (1955.3). However, using the arbitrary estimate mentioned above, numbering will start at 1,290,000, giving an estimate of 110,000for 1955 for arsenal code 296. Arsenal 26's 1955 lowest reported is 30134xx and highest is 33289xx, for an estimated 330,000. Thus, the total for 1955 would be about 440,000. Arsenal code 26 presumably produced for 9 months, 3 times as long as code 296. Therefore the figures of 330,000 for code 26 and 110,000 for code 296 do fit.

    1956 - The lowest is 40016xx and highest is 40530xx for an estimated 54,000. In 1955, the production averaged over 35,000 per month. At this rate production ended in very early 1956.

    1960 - Series A - K were reported as well as “I”, which looks like an upside down exclamation point. There has been 9000 numbers in different series reported to suggest that the series were fully completed. However, only 2 numbers were reported for Series “K” and the high number is 03xx. If “k” was the last series, I cannot say if 10,000 were made to complete this series. For now, we can say that an estimated 120,000 were made in 1960.

    Note about 1961: I have observed a photo of one that really seems like 1961. It is 45xx digit of series J, a series which has several others reported as 1960 with numbers both higher and lower. We have to assume that this was the result of a worn die used for the “)”. In the blockstyle font used in 1960 dated guns, a “0" (zero) can look like a “1" only the one side of the zero remains and the rest is worn or broken off.


    Total production: estimated at 963,000. These findings are subject to change with more data.

    Other notes

    Arsenal codes 296 and 26 are presumably the same arsenal. There may have been some reorganization in 1955.

    Opinion on the 1960 guns

    The gap in production from 1957 - 1959 were probably due to the arsenal’s need to gear up, train workers, etc. and to produce the Type 56 carbine (Chinese SKS)and Type 56 assault rifle (Chinese AK). By 1960, perhaps enough of the new arms were produced to re-equip the standing army, and some production capacity could be diverted to obsolescent or otherwise no-longer-primary issue equipment. My opinion is this was mainly for export. A large portion of the Vietnam bring-backs, perhaps a majority, were 1960 guns. Some of them were not sold and remained in China. To make things complex, many of the older 1953-56 guns were also sent as military aid by the China over the years.



    Written by Gunboard member “ryg” and rewritten by “Tex” for use on the Mosin/Nagant Collectors Forum.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails AChiComtype53.jpg  
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  30. #30
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    Great info. Check out this thread I started last year on Ted's site: Parchment found in T53 cleaning rod recess
    Also, I have a thread on field stock repairs of T53s which is here on GBs. Started around the same time. Both will give you a bit more info about these fine rifles from some very experienced folks. I do have a little discrepancy with the most excellent research of ryg. I have a T53 dated 1953.1 It is very faint and my crappy camera refuses to photograph it clearly unfortunately. The rifle is well worn and mismatched.
    Best regards,
    Tom

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pahtu View Post
    I did not know it either - According to Ted, it is a rather difficult carbine to find with that receiver - I don't see many of these for sale locally that are not butchered/bubba'd.

    I saw this one at a local show and bought it for 60 bucks.

    Pahtu.
    Great rifle. Has anyone else had the theory that that gun was rebarreled on a Izhevsk action and got a Tula bolt when rearsenaled? Most interesting.

    Excellent thread. Thanks to all contributors.

  32. #32
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    Here's what I've heard as an explanation for the for the various observed features of the rifles: They were initially designed for second line service/training in China, but the SKS came along fairly quickly afterwards and replaced it in second line service, relegating the rifles to training use only. After that, they were vastly overstocked and a large number of them were shipped to Vietnam as war aid, with the remainder being kept as trainers. The imported ones that are in horrid condition were buried for some reason (depending on who you ask, it was either: buried by China to disguise the fact that they existed, buried by the Vietcong to disguise the fact that they were receiving war aid from China, or buried by the Vietcong in weapons depots that were dug up after the war and sold back to China in exchange for Type 56 AKs), and at some point were sold by China as surplus.

    One metric **** ton of them are mismatched to some degree, implying that they were rebuilt at some point. Judging by the general condition of these rebuilds, they were likely done in a hurry by a country that didn't have the time to do a complete refurb, lending credence to the idea that they were used in Vietnam. Of course, the damage is also quite possibly the result of extremely long and heavy use in a training program (see also: the Romanian "Instructie" rifles)
    Signed,

    Fatherandersonthepaladin
    Purveyor of fine Mosins, Hater of Bubba, and Pantsless Evil Dictator of Eggplants.

  33. #33
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    This is great!!...I have learned SOOOO much as a direct result of starting this thread!!...and the knowledge just keeps coming!!...such a wealth of information on a very interesting piece of military history!!
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike radford View Post
    Great rifle. Has anyone else had the theory that that gun was rebarreled on a Izhevsk action and got a Tula bolt when rearsenaled? Most interesting.

    Excellent thread. Thanks to all contributors.
    I have not seen another before this one, and was surprised that 7.62x54r was looking for one - I have not seen his WTB page for a long while to see if he has found one yet.

    Pahtu.

  35. #35
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    My Chinese T-53 no import mark anywhere. It's very blue and all other numbers have been scrubbed...no number bolt, mag, or on butt. 1954.11



    1943 Tula M91/30 Lami
    1966 Ishapore 2A1
    Helwan Brigadier

  36. #36
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    Now some historical pics. Not sure if these are 100% chinese m44s since during vietnam war many soviet m44s were used too..Click image for larger version. 

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    Please, put your imput on the Mosin Nagant sniper rifle database.
    look at:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=21990

    Vz54/57 & 54/91 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...36#post2504436

    Type 53 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...32#post2778832

  37. #37
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    more

    Ehi Bob, look at the third photo.. Is it your gun? :D

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Please, put your imput on the Mosin Nagant sniper rifle database.
    look at:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?t=21990

    Vz54/57 & 54/91 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...36#post2504436

    Type 53 survey:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...32#post2778832

  38. #38
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    Those pics are...well, I can't even come up with words...my step-Dad served in the early years of Vietnam, and let's just say...this thread has opened my eyes!!!....and then this!!!...wow!!
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  39. #39
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    North Florida
    Posts
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    Default T-53 refurb?

    Thanks to you and the author for the information.

    I picked up a Navy Arms 1955 "26" T-53 in a pawn shop a few months ago for $120.00 otd. It has a good bore, used, but not abused, stock, faded but complete blue and with correct cleaning rod. The bore is dark but has strong rifling.

    What I find interesting about this particular rifle is that the bolt has no serial, and appears to have never had one, (no signs of grinding) and the mag. floor plate is the same. (never serialized) The butt plate is seven digit serialized, but not matching. The only stock marking I can see is the number "6" stamped in the left finger groove.

    Seems to me to be a refurb, with no intrest in force matching numbers.

    No pics, it looks just like the others

  40. #40
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    Kalifornia
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    Hey all, thanks for the posts and great info...

    here is an older thread I found here on GBoards that I thought was pretty interesting:

    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...ese-K-44-AT-44

    Also, a newer post I missed when I was poking around:

    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...k&daysprune=75
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  41. #41
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
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    I have one; serial number 3307xxx. It is matching bolt, floor plate and butt plate. It is not import marked except for "MIKE" inscribed on the left side of the butt. I am assuming it is a Vietnam bring back. I had already won one item at an auction and wanted to spread out the shipping costs when this one came up. It looked a little rough but the bid was only $20 when I hit "bid". Some one else did the same thing slightly ahead of me. They got the $30 bid and I got the $40 bid which won it.
    Click image for larger version. 

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  42. #42

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    Here's one of my favorite shots of Vietnam capture rifles. These are in pretty good shape! Notice the k98 in the middle of the pile. I picked up an all matching 1956 a few months back from Arizona when he was still selling them. Rough shape, but shootable. All chinese parts.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 2957767733_549898a4b4.jpg  

  43. #43
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    Jun 2011
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    Kalifornia
    Posts
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    Gotta love the GunBoards!!...I learn SO much here!!...not trying to invent my own sticky, but...here is another post about T53 accessories!!...

    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?234325-Chicom-Type-53-(M44)-accessories-Huh

    j
    ust trying to consolidate as many posts as I can about this enigmatic carbine!!....so...if nobody has an issue with it, and I am not stepping on any mods' or admins' toes...I am gonna link ALL posts about the Type 53 back here...to THIS thread...

    PLEASE!!...add more info!!...and. link more older posts that you might know about!!

    Thanks you guys!!
    MY FIRST TEN MOSIN NAGANTS:
    1925 Izhevsk m1891/30 Ex-Dragoon- "Katalin"
    1939 Tula m1891/30 Lam. Stock- "Irena"
    1934 Tikka m27- "Tiina-Rakel"
    1938 Tula m1891/30 Finn Captured- "Nainen Sodassa"
    1955 Type 53 Carbine- "Thu Huong"
    1944 Tikka m1891/30- "Isoäiti"
    1942 VKT m1891- "Mummo"
    1916 Tula PTG m1891 Finn'd- "Petra"
    1967 No-Maker m39- "Tuuli"
    1926-8 Bohler-Stahl m24- "Vanha Rouva"

  44. #44
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    504

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpeedmanRC View Post
    My Chinese T-53 no import mark anywhere. It's very blue and all other numbers have been scrubbed...no number bolt, mag, or on butt. 1954.11

    Doh, mine's 1954.10! # 1204757



    Hey speedman, I'll have to pull out my 1954.11 and check the serial number now!
    Last edited by Jaws2; 08-31-2011 at 08:58 PM. Reason: Because my brain goes to fast sometimes!

  45. #45
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    Feb 2010
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    Back in NE Illinois
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    Great thread! I really enjoy my 2 Type 53's. They are both from Omega in AZ. I got them from him in 12/09. The 53 is neat as the only actually chinese parts on it are the barrel and reciever, the rest is soviet. The 54 is all matching and has lots of "character". Both have great bores and are fun shooters.
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