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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    The Ozark Mountains
    Posts
    153

    Default 22 caliber older military training rifles

    This posting is a request (plea?) for information concerning any and all foreign (to the U.S. that is) older 22 caliber military training rifles. I have become intrigued by the Mauser/Walther 22, Lee-Enfield22, Polish Mosin-Nagant 22s, etc., and intend to continue to develop my collection. I have posted this request in MN forum as well.

    Of particular interest at the moment, I would like to learn of any experiences you may have had with the Polish made 22 caliber trainer, WZ 48. I am committed to buying one and am now awaiting delivery. Have I bought what one might be referred to in the 22 caliber training world as a commonly known "dud?"

    Is this one likely to compete well (accuracy) with my Walther KKW, Brit. no. 2 mk 4? The WZ 48's rear sight slide goes out/up to only 100 metres. Why? Other 22 caliber trainers I have go twice that plus.

    Have most countries that have been engaged in war produced 22 caliber trainers. Are some more noteworthy than others? While it may be a matter of personal judgment, which 22 trainers rank at the top in overall desirability? (accuracy, ease of operation, robustness etc.)

    If you were to rank the best 22 caliber military training rifles (historical) from the top to the bottom, what one or two would you put at the top of the list, what one or two would be at the bottom?

    As you might guess, I am just starting my education about these very intriguing little rifles, and wish to thank you for any personal experiences you can share with me.

    Sincerely,

    ozark hillbilly

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    WI
    Posts
    675

    Default

    I would list the ones I have personal experiance with:
    KKW
    Enfield
    WZ48
    DSM-34
    Mossberg M42Mb
    H&R M65
    JGA Germania sportmodell
    EL-24 unit in mauser 98
    EL-?? unit in steyr M95
    Romanian M69
    French Lebel "type"
    You can switch any two and still be OK. I'm off to work, but can give details later if you're interested.
    Marrage doesn't just happen, you have to get out there and expose yourself to it, you know, like chicken pox.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    argentina
    Posts
    2,208

    Default

    Ozark, the amplitude of your qestionnaire would require a long answer-My suggestion, now that you've become interested in military trainers, is that you seek on this 22 forum the archive of hundreds of posts about the matter and I'm sure the answers will more than interest you and you'll learn a lot of details that cant be included in only one answer to your question
    I am an international Gunboards patron

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    1,491

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ozark hillbilly View Post
    The WZ 48's rear sight slide goes out/up to only 100 metres. Why? Other 22 caliber trainers I have go twice that plus.
    I'd say the Polish were a bit more realistic with their sighting system!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    299

    Default

    I would say that for me the best would be the following:

    Enfield, lithgow 22's
    German
    polish

    How ever the best one i have ever fired is the Patt 14 No 1 trainer with the aprker hiscock magazine, went out to 150 yards with no problem at all. I also beleive that they only made 128 of these and the Patt 14 No2 only about 430 of them made. can anyone confirm those numbers of manufacture please.
    You can not benefit the poor by pulling down the rich (Roosevelt )

  6. #6

    Default

    Personal experience:

    Lee Enfield No 8 .22 training rifle. Held in school shed (with hundreds of No 4s - some shooters - and about a dozen Brens). Taken out at lunch time and carried across the football field to the 25 yard range on the school grounds. It has been a long time since you could do that. Very cool little rifle. If I could find the one I preferred (big silver "5" painted on the butt) I would pay over the market for it.

    Vickers Empire Model. Bought for the Parker Hale foresight elements that came with it (!!!) but discovered that it was in very good working condition and frighteningly accurate. Martini action, so you can play Rourke's Drift, although your laughing plays merry h311 with your aim. I believe that the Vickers, while built for the civilian shooting fraternity, was used extensively for military training (I have seen them with broad arrow stamps).

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    299

    Default

    I agree with you about the No8 nice to shoot i used to shoot them in the cadets at school, I have a No9 that i have never shot and am looking forward to shoot that rifle soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOriginalBeelzebub View Post
    Personal experience:

    Lee Enfield No 8 .22 training rifle. Held in school shed (with hundreds of No 4s - some shooters - and about a dozen Brens). Taken out at lunch time and carried across the football field to the 25 yard range on the school grounds. It has been a long time since you could do that. Very cool little rifle. If I could find the one I preferred (big silver "5" painted on the butt) I would pay over the market for it.

    Vickers Empire Model. Bought for the Parker Hale foresight elements that came with it (!!!) but discovered that it was in very good working condition and frighteningly accurate. Martini action, so you can play Rourke's Drift, although your laughing plays merry h311 with your aim. I believe that the Vickers, while built for the civilian shooting fraternity, was used extensively for military training (I have seen them with broad arrow stamps).
    You can not benefit the poor by pulling down the rich (Roosevelt )

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