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  1. #1
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    Default Vepr 7.62X54R / PSL

    -Some pics of my Vepr and PSL.Iron wood upper and lower handguard .I will change the trigger on RSA and RPK flash hider on the way,I like the stock,but maybe will change it after meeting with Mat from Iron Wood. Overall its a beautiful rifle, cant wait to go to the range and shoot some Russian 180g













    scope PSOP 3-9X42, love it
    Last edited by atakacorp; 08-03-2011 at 06:15 PM.
    Golani 12th Battalion

  2. #2
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    So the VEPR will handle heavy ball? If so, thats as good a reason as any to own one.

    Looks like a nice pair .

    Keith

  3. #3
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    I didn't see any restriction about heavy ball,but may be I will play safe and stay with the light ball for now , is anyone has info on this?
    Golani 12th Battalion

  4. #4
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    Boy, when they call the PSL a long stroke action they are not kidding. How long is that gas piston and what is the feel of the two different actions? Is it me or does the VEPR butt have a very long pull length?
    Damn the expense, use your turn signals today... and as a special favour, try doing it before you have two wheels in the next lane.

  5. #5

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    Nice. What mag release did you put on it? Also, are you threading the muzzle? If so, what thread pitch?

  6. #6

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    I know with my PSL the recoil isnt too hard, but it's very crazy. It gets a lot of inertia in random directions, probably from that massive gas piston arrangement. I just figured it was about trying to bleed off excess pressure.

  7. #7
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    There's a guy over on another board that cracked his rear trunnion and the reinforcing plate after 600 rds of HB in his PSL. FWIW.

  8. #8
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    I"ll thread it with 5/8-24 RH

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ID:	451344 this is kalifornia legal AK BB
    Golani 12th Battalion

  9. #9
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    Yep, PSL and HB wont mix, but Vepr is build better IMO, checked manual and no restricktions about HB I will try to contact Molot and ask them .
    Golani 12th Battalion

  10. #10

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    Good idea. The manual states to use hunting ammo. Doesn't say anything about weight.

  11. #11
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    Just talked to the guy from MOLOT,he says 180g,200g no problem.
    Golani 12th Battalion

  12. #12
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    could someone explain to me how the VEPR is a better build than the PSL? I agree that it may be more refined, but how does that tanslate structurally--especially in the Heavy Ball vs Light Ball debate? Are the rivets stronger? Are the trunnions reinforced? What makes these rifles capable of heavy ball use?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcom the first View Post
    There's a guy over on another board that cracked his rear trunnion and the reinforcing plate after 600 rds of HB in his PSL. FWIW.
    Would an AK style recoil buffer have helped or prevented the cracked trunnion?

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by atakacorp View Post
    Just talked to the guy from MOLOT,he says 180g,200g no problem.
    That's great to hear.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by the444shooter View Post
    could someone explain to me how the VEPR is a better build than the PSL? I agree that it may be more refined, but how does that tanslate structurally--especially in the Heavy Ball vs Light Ball debate? Are the rivets stronger? Are the trunnions reinforced? What makes these rifles capable of heavy ball use?
    Probably not strictly better built per-se... although the Veprs are considered the Premier Russian AK family build... Likely the gas system of the VEPR was timed to work properly with hunting ammo and not beat you or the rifle up too bad... My guess is that the gas system on the Vepr is set up a bit softer than on the PSL... at least that's how I would do it....

    The PSL - being a true "Combat" rifle may be more over-gassed... Let's face it - the action cycling reliably on miscellaneous vintages of surplus ammo is a virtue on the battlefield.... but it's not really as critical out at the shooting range or in the deer blind.... Unfortunately, it has negative implications when sport shooting "Hunting" ammo..... especially the heavy stuff....

    It also means that the Vepr may short stroke on really light load ammo....

    Thanks

  16. #16
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    I'm just curious about Molot's response...seems a standard russian response "sure, no problem!"...I'd still be wary of going heavy in that rifle...

  17. #17
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    I like my dad's POSP 3-9x42 also. Put the green LED in it and put the red off to the side for a spare. Good scope though not nearly as precise as a Pentax or Nikon in the adjustments. But makes up for it in ruggedness and durability. Someday I'll grab a PKA red dot for ours and maybe the el-cheapy russian night vision Kalinka or Eastwave sells. After I un debt myself.

  18. #18
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    Like it! Is that the ridiculous "California Legal Mag Release"? If it shoots heavy ball too, may need to trade my PSL in for one!!!


    Gun Lover by Birth, Soldier by Choice!

    Remember Guns Don't Kill People, Stupid People Kill People!

  19. #19
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    Is there a difference in the barrel contours? It looks like the Vepr has a slightly more heavy barrel, but it's hard to tell. Thanks for the pics and the info!

  20. #20
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    Hello Atakacorp. Those are nice rifles. I like the Vepr but I wish it had more of a PSL/ SVD type stock. An M76 Yugo stock and pistol grip would also look cool. Let us know how it shoots if you can. Heck, do a compairison between the two!

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by truckjohn View Post
    Probably not strictly better built per-se... although the Veprs are considered the Premier Russian AK family build... Likely the gas system of the VEPR was timed to work properly with hunting ammo and not beat you or the rifle up too bad... My guess is that the gas system on the Vepr is set up a bit softer than on the PSL... at least that's how I would do it....

    The PSL - being a true "Combat" rifle may be more over-gassed... Let's face it - the action cycling reliably on miscellaneous vintages of surplus ammo is a virtue on the battlefield.... but it's not really as critical out at the shooting range or in the deer blind.... Unfortunately, it has negative implications when sport shooting "Hunting" ammo..... especially the heavy stuff....

    It also means that the Vepr may short stroke on really light load ammo....

    Thanks
    Definitely less gassed. The brass only goes a few feet, not 10 yards like the PSL. Also lower mass of the bolt/carrier. About 13 ounces for the Vepr, and 20 ounces on the PSL.

  22. #22
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    Talked to Vasiliy from MOLOT again and asked for semi official latter with the explanation about havy ball ammo with VeprX54, he will e-mail me, after the meeting with chiff engeneer , I will post it.
    Golani 12th Battalion

  23. #23
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    Cool

    man i would love to have that wood on my gun!
    instead of that black plastic on my 308 sagia with fold down cheek piece.....
    nice looking grains if it would fit, i would trade you even..

  24. #24
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    Even thou I am only using light ball surplus ammo , I installed a Blackjack recoil buffer on my PSL . 400 rds later , not a single problem with it ... the damn thing cycles perfectly . I also put another buffer to my Saiga .223 , just in case . Prevention is a good thing.
    Last edited by josey88; 08-15-2011 at 02:58 PM.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by josey88 View Post
    Even thou I am only using light ball surplus ammo , I installed a Blackjack recoil buffer on my PSL . 400 rds later , not a
    single problem with it ... the damn thing cycles perfectly . I also put another buffer to my Saiga .223 , just in case . Prevention is a good thing.
    Buffer's aren't always a good thing. Sometimes it causes more problems in the long term. The energy of the carrier slamming backwards isn't going to be dissipated into thin air. The energy goes somewhere.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by josey88 View Post
    Even thou I am only using light ball surplus ammo , I installed a Blackjack recoil buffer on my PSL . 400 rds later , not a single problem with it ... the damn thing cycles perfectly . I also put another buffer to my Saiga .223 , just in case . Prevention is a good thing.
    Those buffers do nothing but take your money. All they do is deliver the carrier energy to the rear trunnion nearly every time. If it doesn't short stroke your rifle it most likely isn't helping it at all. But, whatever floats the boat. Try a new recoil spring or your rifle may be over gassed.

    Anyway the PSL has a breakin period. "More than just a few mags..."

  27. #27

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    Buffers work by slowing down the bolt carrier assm. over a distance, lessening the peak impact force, I know it's only about an 1/8 of an inch or so but it helps, put your hand on a solid table and wack it with a hammer, now put a slab of rubber on top of your hand and wack it again, hurts less! (just an example don't try this)

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by machanic View Post
    Buffers work by slowing down the bolt carrier assm. over a distance, lessening the peak impact force, I know it's only about an 1/8 of an inch or so but it helps, put your hand on a solid table and wack it with a hammer, now put a slab of rubber on top of your hand and wack it again, hurts less! (just an example don't try this)
    That is exactly my line of reasoning , so I`ll keep the buffer .

  29. #29
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    If your rifle short strokes, take it off. If it runs fine, keep it on. No harm done, and possibly prevented, over the long run.

    Keith

  30. #30

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    A simple check for shortstroking is to put a small amount of playdoh, a pea sized piece on the rear trunion in the area where the bolt carrier impacts, fire one round and check to see how flat it is, I prefer the hot pink color eisier to find for cleanup!! That Vepr carrier and bolt look like a Ak but with huge lugs do you have a AK carrier to compare it to?

  31. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by jdub View Post
    Anyway the PSL has a breakin period. "More than just a few mags..."
    My PSL functioned flawlessly for the first several hundred ruonds until I tried to run some surplus ammo in it. Turns out one of my mags doesnt like surplus ammo. I dont know why people get this break in period thing with the PSL, but it probably has a lot more to do with magazine inconsistency than anythign else. My other mags feed surplus fine.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by atakacorp View Post
    -Some pics of my Vepr and PSL.....
    Nice looking rifles. How's the accuracy on the PSL...?? I'm thinking very seriously about picking one up, they're still available new from at least one source that I know of @ a fairly reasonable prices, and even adding the Black Horse polymer stock it's still well within my fiscal limitations. I do have one other question... is the adjustable cheekrest on the poly stock able to rotate to the right, ie. in a useable position for a lefty...?? Thanks.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shoobedoo View Post
    Nice looking rifles. How's the accuracy on the PSL...?? I'm thinking very seriously about picking one up, they're still available new from at least one source that I know of @ a fairly reasonable prices, and even adding the Black Horse polymer stock it's still well within my fiscal limitations. I do have one other question... is the adjustable cheekrest on the poly stock able to rotate to the right, ie. in a useable position for a lefty...?? Thanks.
    I've been assured that the PSL is capable of shooting MOA "all day long".*


    John








    * "All day long" is how long it will take you to go through a magazine and keep them in a "group", since you have to let the rifle cool off completely, between shots.

  34. #34
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    I love my PSL ,if it the original Romanian at the source that you have, get it,because it hard to find now,usually they are American made from the kits rifles.cheekrest can rotate.Accuracy,I say its the guy behind the trigger, I can make 1" MOA if I try hard (shooting with 1 min intervals to make barrel cool off,using the ammo that she likes CZH,Ygo light ball),But its 1.5,2 inch when you have fun with it,Good for hunting,my daughter dropped 450LB hog with it,I got more then a dozen feral pigs and a mule deer from 80 to 200 yards,so I say its accurate Great rifle , ammo is available and cheep.Semi automatic rifle with the scope for 700-800$ definitely worth it
    Last edited by atakacorp; 08-18-2011 at 12:21 PM.
    Golani 12th Battalion

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by atakacorp View Post
    I love my PSL ,if it the original Romanian at the source that you have, get it,because it hard to find now,usually they are American made from the kits rifles.cheekrest can rotate.Accuracy,I say its the guy behind the trigger, I can make 1" MOA if I try hard (shooting with 1 min intervals to make barrel cool off,using the ammo that she likes CZH,Ygo light ball),But its 1.5,2 inch when you have fun with it,Good for hunting,my daughter dropped 450LB hog with it,I got more then a dozen feral pigs and a mule deer from 80 to 200 yards,so I say its accurate Great rifle , ammo is available and cheep.Semi automatic rifle with the scope for 700-800$ definitely worth it
    Thanks for the replies gents. The rifle I'm looking at is sold by an outfit called Centerfire Systems out of Kentucky, the ad simply says "Romanian Manufactured, 7.62x54R, Romanian made receiver" They also call it a "Dragunov" which I know it's not, strictly speaking, but it's just semantics, and I'm not worried about that. BTW, I'm not too concerned about their disclaimer on the scope rail needing to be modified for "original" PSOP mounts to fit, as I'm looking at using one of the US made mounts with a Weaver/Picatinny base on top that are designed to fit the PSL, and topping it off with a regular US style scope. I'm still not too sure if this is a "real" PSL or not though, and would you say this is the real deal, or a Kit like you mentioned...?? 1 MOA is probably better than I can shoot consitently anyhow, and 1 min. intervals between shots wouldn't bother me in the least. Thanks also for the info on the stock cheekrest, as the wooden stock is probably not very comfortable for Lefties like me. I'm really itching for one of these, so I do appreciate your input, thanks.

    http://centerfiresystems.com/DRA-GUN-B.aspx

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by trainsktg View Post
    If your rifle short strokes, take it off. If it runs fine, keep it on. No harm done, and possibly prevented, over the long run.

    Keith
    I haven`t notice anything wrong with it while firing and the rifle cycles perfectly , with no hiccups , no nothing . That means that it tolerates the buffer . And the buffer shows only very tiny slight marks , so is not being smacked very hard . The only thing that I have noticed is when I rack the carrier bolt to chamber a rd , it has a shorter travel because of the buffer, but that is expected.

  37. #37
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    Shoobedoo, tough to tell without seeing the manufacturers info on the side of the rifle (well, actually the underneath of the rifle in this case). The part about modifying the scope rails for PSOP (it's POSP if I remember correctly in any case) has me stumped, as my romanian-built PSL handles standard "SVD bracket" POSP scopes/mounts just fine (and holds the zero nicely). But like you said, no concern if you're going to go another route anyway!

    Nice to hear from another lefty PSL shooter! One of the first things I did was to get an ITC cheekrest pad, love it!! Upgraded the scope to 8x42 POSP, refinished the stock to russian red (preference) and added a bipod/bipod adapter from an AR-15 that fits perfectly in the lower handguard vent, so no mod to the stock needed.

    I love shooting this rifle and it always gets a look of looks at the range. Here's a pic (before and after stock refinishing/new scope):

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  38. #38
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    Great looking rifle Hasso, both before and after. Thanks for the tip on the ITC cheek pad, I'll have to check that out. I guess the only way to find out just what this rifle is, and what kind of mount will work with it is to give these guys a call and see what they've got to say. Do any of you guys know anything about the "FPK" rifles by TGI...?? They use a US made Nodak/Spud receiver, which I hear are very good, and Romanian barrels and parts. The biggest question I have about these is will they take a Blackhorse Poly stock.

    http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct938.aspx

    http://thedsmlab.com/adjustablepolystock.html

  39. #39
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    Feeding on a new PSL can be helped along with some careful polishing in the right places. I did the rails in my receiver, the top of the hammer had a burr, the ejector was cut too sharp, etc. Look at what binds the gun up manually cycling it with the topcover off. I polish the mags feed lips like glass also and that really smooths it out. A few hundred rounds to do this naturally can be done out of the box, but do it carefully as it could be bad to do it wrong. Go slowly. I say polish the feed lips very first and go from there. Remember a semiauto cycles with the bolt fully rearward and not holding onto the charging handle. i.e. let it slam shut, you can hang anything up manually slowing it down. One of my mags was pitted and the lips were the same. It will hang up rounds when the mag is full, but at 8 or 9 it won't. I still need to work on that one but the point is that the gun only will feed badly with this mag in certain circumstances. Only use super fine grits to do these tasks and you will not have a problem.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by bootleggerspub View Post
    Feeding on a new PSL can be helped along with some careful polishing in the right places. I did the rails in my receiver, the top of the hammer had a burr, the ejector was cut too sharp, etc. Look at what binds the gun up manually cycling it with the topcover off. I polish the mags feed lips like glass also and that really smooths it out. A few hundred rounds to do this naturally can be done out of the box, but do it carefully as it could be bad to do it wrong. Go slowly. I say polish the feed lips very first and go from there. Remember a semiauto cycles with the bolt fully rearward and not holding onto the charging handle. i.e. let it slam shut, you can hang anything up manually slowing it down. One of my mags was pitted and the lips were the same. It will hang up rounds when the mag is full, but at 8 or 9 it won't. I still need to work on that one but the point is that the gun only will feed badly with this mag in certain circumstances. Only use super fine grits to do these tasks and you will not have a problem.
    I fixed my feeding problem by polling the lip of the mag up with the pliers ,just look witch side of the mag wont feed.
    Golani 12th Battalion

  41. #41
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    So...has anyone shot their new Vepr yet? I'm looking pretty hard at buying one.

  42. #42
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    THAT is beautiful wood. Very nice-lookin rifle. With the reduced mass of the bolt/carrier, I'd stay away from HB.

    Heavier HUNTING rounds, loaded to reduced pressures are fine, even in the PSL. The combo of heavy bullet AND heavy charge is what makes Heavy Ball a no-no! Tiring of that debate is one reason why I haven't been around much, lately. That and the "I'm gonna improve my PSL with $5,000 worth of mods!" Buffers do NOT help with over-pressure situations. Thinking so is fooling yourself, and courting disaster. I have seen PSL's with hammered rears from less than 5o rounds of HB. NO, I didn't take pics, because we didn't think anyone would be as hard-headed about it as some have been, in the Boards.

    I'd stay safe, and enjoy that rifle. A good 150 grain-ish hunting round will kill ANY medium-sized game on North America.
    Join the PSL Owners' Group. I'll approve you as soon as I see your request.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by TW1Kell View Post
    THAT is beautiful wood. Very nice-lookin rifle. With the reduced mass of the bolt/carrier, I'd stay away from HB.

    Heavier HUNTING rounds, loaded to reduced pressures are fine, even in the PSL. The combo of heavy bullet AND heavy charge is what makes Heavy Ball a no-no! Tiring of that debate is one reason why I haven't been around much, lately. That and the "I'm gonna improve my PSL with $5,000 worth of mods!" Buffers do NOT help with over-pressure situations. Thinking so is fooling yourself, and courting disaster. I have seen PSL's with hammered rears from less than 5o rounds of HB. NO, I didn't take pics, because we didn't think anyone would be as hard-headed about it as some have been, in the Boards.

    I'd stay safe, and enjoy that rifle. A good 150 grain-ish hunting round will kill ANY medium-sized game on North America.
    I'll stay with light ball ,killed lots of wild pigs and deer with 150 SP PrvPartizan.But I will put 100 rounds of HB trou her,just for fun. Cannot wait to go shoot,tried to change the trigger to RSA did not work,so I am putting G2 in(original trigger rely suck),hopefully end of this week will post pics
    Golani 12th Battalion

  44. #44
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    Just got email from MOLOT


    short translation is ,that Vepr can handle all range of bullets suitable for 7.62X54R,the proper gas pressure was tested at their laboratory and its clear with government standards, so its GTG gentlemen

    Vice president and chief engineer S.V. Urzumtsev


    Heavy Ball is a go with Vepr
    Last edited by atakacorp; 08-24-2011 at 11:03 AM.
    Golani 12th Battalion

  45. #45
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    That would be a fun read translated. You have a very nice rifle, the VEPR I mean. I like my PSL but that thing has me liking it a lot. How much are the mags for it? I like cheap 54r and nice to see HB can be fired in that rifle. It would have to be less gassed just from the mass of that bolt and carrier mechanism or it would beat itself apart in a few short minutes if it were not. I also have never had a problem with my PSL blowing cases 10 yards out so maybe mine has a smaller than average gas port on it? I usually shoot Bulgarian Surplus and want a couple cases more of that stuff. Am I seeing things or does the VEPR have a human length of pull?

    "Nice to hear from another lefty PSL shooter! One of the first things I did was to get an ITC cheekrest pad, love it!! Upgraded the scope to 8x42 POSP, refinished the stock to russian red (preference) and added a bipod/bipod adapter from an AR-15 that fits perfectly in the lower handguard vent, so no mod to the stock needed."

    Hassoboxhead: Hey what bipod mount did you use from an AR15? I like the way yours is set up.

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