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06-02-2012, 07:59 PM #1
Info Needed on this WWI German 13.2mm TuF Round
I went to an auction today and picked this round up for a very reasonable price. I know what it is and what gun used it, but I can not find anything online pertaining to the value or headstamp. I am assuming that "18" on the bottom stands for 1918, but the other markings are unknown to me. There also appears to be a script "P" on the bottom of the projectile itself. I found one on another website that had already sold, but there was no price. It was marked "Very Rare". Are these rounds that rare? If so, what is the estimated value? Also, what do the other markings on the bottom mean? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
06-03-2012, 02:35 AM #2Senior Member
- Join Date
- Jan 2008
06-06-2012, 12:25 AM #3Senior Member
- Join Date
- Dec 1969
- Brisbane, Australia
P--Polte Armaturen & Munition Fabrik, Magdeburg ( Armaturen ==Electric motors and Munitions)
T== TuF Tank und Flieger ( abwehr) patronen Tank and aircraft (anti) Cartridge.
67== Cartridge Brass, 67/33 Copper/Zinc
8 18=== Month and year of manufacture ( August , 1918); a rather "common" month...the rare months are April (4-18) and May (5-18)... none have been seen earlier than April ( ie, no 3,2,or 1) allthough the Gun itself was in project and early production from late 1917 to early 1918...maybe all those pre-April dates were used up in tests and trials. Production of T18 cartridges seemingly stopped in November 1918 (no 12-18 known).
The Cartridge did not die, however. Sweden adopted the rifle and cartridge in 1921 ( Panser Gevaar M21) and made both for some years.
The Russians tested various Maxim designs (Including probably an original TuF MG) and tried to use the cartridge for both AT and Aviation use...but by the mid-1920s, designers in the USSR had moved on with better case and Gun designs (Degtyarev, etc).
The Chinese bought a lot of the T18 rifles as Surplus in the 1920s and early 30s, and ordered ammo from both FN and Eidgenossische Munitions Fabrik Thun (Swiss)...this latter order includes the nationalist Sunburst in the headstamp. They were used on ancient Walled city gates ("door knockers") against armoured cars, and against trains ( a shot across a loco boiler would soon cause a locomotive to stop from water and steam loss, without destroying the loco totally.
It is rumored that the FN manufacture was also for Poland and the Baltic States, which had T18 guns left over from WW I, and Poland also had a couple or more A7V Tanks, which were set up for T18s as subsidiary AT armamament (besides the 57mm Russian Nordenfeldt Cannon) fitted to them.
Original cartridges (German and others) are what one would call "Rare"...most have been pulled, the primer struck,the Powder discarded, and the bullet roughly replaced. Very few examples remain intact...most existing today are "Battlefield Pickups" ( Aussie, NZ, American and Brit.) because most remaining stocks of Guns and Ammo in Germany were destroyed after WW I. (As were the unfinished TuF MG 1918).
07-10-2012, 07:19 AM #4Member
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
Hi FoxHound 0985,
I recently purchsed a Tuf M1918 Mauser anti-tank rifle and am looking to purchase anything that looks like a round of the original 13mm ammo to display with the rifle. Would you consider selling your deactivated round? My late father flew the P51D in the 3rd Air Force, but never made it over seas.