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  1. #1
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    Default Ted Williams Shotgun Forum

    I usually collect oddities like Winchester 40's and 50's, Yet I have two of these great Sears Ted Williams 200 Shotguns SN# P296xxx and P375xxx and one model 300 SN# Q43xxx but know little of them except they were made by Sears can anyone give an MFG date on them the estate I purchased them from claim as well as they can remember Grampa had them since the mid sixties. all have vented ribs and one has a factory installed adjustable end of the barrel muzzle break, all safties are on the trigger, and all have fancy checkered stocks . They are attractive well made cool looking shotguns. I think made by Winchester. Shoot and function well , I know as for collectors they are not very popular as I escaped with three for a hair less than $200.00 Any Ted Williams collectors or enthusiasts on this planet please post your thoughts.
    Last edited by box20022; 09-17-2012 at 10:01 PM.

  2. #2
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    No shotgun was made by Sears . They

    were made by a number of top brand

    name companies . Most pumps I have

    seen were made by Winchester . I really

    like store brand shotguns .

    Pics would help with ID .



    FIVESHOT

  3. #3
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    Forgive me I meant sold by Sears. I love the store brands also but some are hard to track down. I still own a Simmons Hardware Store Cannonbreach Single Barrel Shotgun 12G SN#Q5955 that I still cannot date. Will upload pictures when I get my hands on a camera , my cell phone camera lens is all scratched up. The Ted Williams are all in great shape minus the usual light nicks and scratches.

  4. #4
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    Yep I bought mine in 72 and it was made by Winchester. It was in 3 inch 20 gauge with adj. choke and a metal cap on stock for personalization. Think the barrel measured 27 inches. Not a bad gun for the money but did not care for aluminum receiver. Paid about $130 if I remember correctly. Too bad they aren't worth more but that Sears name on them I am afraid does not entice collectors. Not a bad gun though.

  5. #5
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    What is the model number on them? That should identify who made them.

  6. #6
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    TW 200 is a Winchester 1200, to meet Sears price line they used cheaper hardwood on the stocks and less finishing internally and externally, but it is still a Winchester inside.

  7. #7
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    Yes Ron Mine was a Model 200 Ted Williams but I believe they produced some with walnut as well as hardwood stocks. Believe mine was walnut but my friend bought one with the hardwood stock.

  8. #8
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    What I always thought strange was rather than just give it different model and name markings , Winchester actually made a different contoured receiver for these . The 1200/1300 gradually angles down at the rear and the 200 has a definate drop off .
    mitch

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  9. #9
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    Default Ted Williams

    Quote Originally Posted by guy sajer View Post
    What I always thought strange was rather than just give it different model and name markings , Winchester actually made a different contoured receiver for these . The 1200/1300 gradually angles down at the rear and the 200 has a definate drop off .
    I think I have come pretty close to the MFG dates of my TW shotguns and they are most likely 1967-68. There is an individual who could identify the date and month of these Ted Williams and I guess most Sears models by the barrel codes . Unfortunately for me to get an exact date of month /year which he has done countless times he has not posted on that other forum for about six months. Anyway the Ted Williams are great shotguns with distinct quality and flare in my opinion and the they are so cheap to aquire due to the lack of collector interest. Thankyou to all !

  10. #10
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    It was a cool time in gun history when one of baseball's biggest stars was marketing his name to use on a firearm

    Also , I believe that if you need a spare barrel the 1200/1300 will fit .

    Maybe you can start a collection of these ? They also made a bolt action based on the model 70 , lever action 94 and I;m pretty sure a semi-auto 22 rifle based on the 190 (maybe others) .
    mitch

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  11. #11
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    What is the serial Number and barrel code ? So I can get a better idea about manufacturing dates of this series if you do not mind. I saw a the one you have for auction and I do not think it will break $200 and it is 95% plus condition.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by guy sajer View Post
    It was a cool time in gun history when one of baseball's biggest stars was marketing his name to use on a firearm

    Also , I believe that if you need a spare barrel the 1200/1300 will fit .

    Maybe you can start a collection of these ? They also made a bolt action based on the model 70 , lever action 94 and I;m pretty sure a semi-auto 22 rifle based on the 190 (maybe others) .
    Ted Williams was signed by Sears in 1962 to test and improve all sporting goods listed in the Sears Catalog. Sears had a huge testing facility . And according to Sears he would field test and offer improvements to the sporting goods department. His name was on everything from Firearms to Outboard motors .

  13. #13
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    I have a thing fot the store brand guns too. Have many J C Higgins guns and several Westen Field. All great shooters. I currently have my eye on a very nice Ted Williams 12 ga O/U that the guy wants $699 for. Really pretty wood and in pristine condition. For a Winchester 101 this would be quite a deal but I think it is a bit high for a Ted Williams. Any feedback would be helpful and appreciated.

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    In 2001 I bought a 1968 Ted Williams M200 3 inch chamber 12 gauge. I bought 3 guns from the same man. He told me the day his dad returned from the service in 68, he and his dad went to Sears and his dad bought the Ted Williams. The shotgun had never been fired and looked like it just came out of the factory. The man's father had died and he came across the gun in the same closet his father had put it in in 1968. He also had the box of Sears Extra Range shells he bought the same day. I knew that the gun wasn't really valuable, but it seemed like a special gun to me, so I decided not to shoot it or sell it. So back into storage with it. I retired recently and have had time to go through some of my stuff. I took the shotgun out and decided to try and find out how much it was worth. I found that for an excelent condition shotgun like this, $300 was the highest estimate. This gun was better than excelent, it had never been fired, but for a year I couldn't get anybody to narrow it down. After all this time, I registared on this sight to get some advise. While I was waiting to be ok'ed so I could post, a gunsmith called that had a collection of guns made for Sears. Someone had given him my number. He was amazed of the condition of the gun. In all his years he had never come accross one this old that had never been fired. He wanted the shotgun and he thought the high value on the gun was $500. Even though he wanted the gun, I believe the $500 price is correct. He also wanted the box of shells. He thought they were worth about $100.


    Now for the curse of the shotgun. I obviously can't bring myself to shoot it and I can't bring myself to sell it. So what it boils down to is that I guess my son will end up with a gun, that by the time he gets it, will be 60 or 70 years old, with a box of shells. I guess he will get to decide what to do with it.

  16. #16
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    Sears began signing exclusive production contracts and investing in firearms manufacturers pretty early, well before they started using house brand names like Ted Williams. Andrew Fryberg & Sons Mfg Company is the earliest I know of, around 1897. In 1905 Sears bought it outright, moved it to Meriden, Connecticut, and manufactured firearms for Sears and other retailers (under different names) up until 1918.

    I guess you could stock a fair sized warehouse with one example of every firearm Sears sold.
    I swear by Jupiter Optimus Maximus .... in the army of the consul Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus and for 10 miles around it I will not steal anything worth more than a sestertius in any one day.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by A1Scooter View Post
    In 2001 I bought a 1968 Ted Williams M200 3 inch chamber 12 gauge. I bought 3 guns from the same man. He told me the day his dad returned from the service in 68, he and his dad went to Sears and his dad bought the Ted Williams. The shotgun had never been fired and looked like it just came out of the factory. The man's father had died and he came across the gun in the same closet his father had put it in in 1968. He also had the box of Sears Extra Range shells he bought the same day. I knew that the gun wasn't really valuable, but it seemed like a special gun to me, so I decided not to shoot it or sell it. So back into storage with it. I retired recently and have had time to go through some of my stuff. I took the shotgun out and decided to try and find out how much it was worth. I found that for an excelent condition shotgun like this, $300 was the highest estimate. This gun was better than excelent, it had never been fired, but for a year I couldn't get anybody to narrow it down. After all this time, I registared on this sight to get some advise. While I was waiting to be ok'ed so I could post, a gunsmith called that had a collection of guns made for Sears. Someone had given him my number. He was amazed of the condition of the gun. In all his years he had never come accross one this old that had never been fired. He wanted the shotgun and he thought the high value on the gun was $500. Even though he wanted the gun, I believe the $500 price is correct. He also wanted the box of shells. He thought they were worth about $100.


    Now for the curse of the shotgun. I obviously can't bring myself to shoot it and I can't bring myself to sell it. So what it boils down to is that I guess my son will end up with a gun, that by the time he gets it, will be 60 or 70 years old, with a box of shells. I guess he will get to decide what to do with it.
    Great story Pal I too had one I bought back in 72. Mine was in 3 inch 20 gauge and had a nice walnut stock. Paid about $125 new back then. Had Adj. choke. Good to hear they are bringing better money finally. Best Wishes

  18. #18
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    I did by this Ted Williams for $535. Maybe I paid too much for it. It surely isn't unfired but it is super clean. I have shot it over 200 times since I bought it and scored over 20 on each round of trap. I am by no means a great trap shooter but my son is. Even he who is of the Benelli only clan was very impressed with the balance and swing. It is beautiful and fits my collection of different stuff very well.

  19. #19
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    What were the serial numbers on the Ted Williams and the two letter barrel codes ? I have been trying to date the serial numbers and two letter barrel codes to the year of MFG . I have come up with a hypothesis on the two letter barrel codes starting with sales in 1964 of the Ted Williams 200 and 300 shotguns. With 1964 the last letter being J for 1964, K for 1965 and alphabetically through X being 1978 the last year of Ted Williams 200/300 production . I believe in 1968 a Q was placed on in front of the Serial numbers for the 300 and for the 200 a letter P . I have kept a loose collection of serial numbers and barrel codes from various gun auction sites and my hypothesis seems to be correct. The first letter of the two letter code I assume is for the month A being January through L being December. I will give some examples .

    Model 300 - SN# 152XX Barrel Code - GJ "G" = July / "J" = 1964
    Model 300 - SN# Q440XX Barrel Code - HO "H" = Aug / "O"= 1969
    Model 300 - SN# Q1515XX Barrel Code - EX "E" = May / "X" = 1978
    Model 200 - SN# P2502XX Barrel Code - CR "C" = Mar / "R" = 1972
    Model 200 - SN# P2962XX Barrel Code - HS "H" = Aug / "S" = 1973




    . I also assume the location of the serial numbers went from under the reciever to the left side of the reciever starting in 1973. As we know the TW models were Winchester 1200/1400s. And the changes incorporated in the Winchester line also were incorporated in the TW line 1964-1967 being 1200/1400's, 1968-1972 being 1200/1400 MKII.

    As you know Winchester was horrible at keeping records and store brand models are even tougher to decipher. So Anyone who owns a Ted Williams 200/300 please post your serial numbers and two letter barrel codes and if you are the original purchaser or know the original purchase date. I have a fairly good list and am building it up month by month. so once again please post your information on your Ted Williams 200/300's so we can get a year by year mfg data base list for this line. Any other Ted Williams affectionados have any input ?
    Last edited by box20022; 10-19-2013 at 04:15 AM.

  20. #20
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    Can only provide a little info Box as I not longer own my Ted Williams 200. Purchased mine in 10/72 and from paper work I discovered S/N was P1344XX. No idea of barrel code however. Mine did have walnut stock and forearm with nickel plated trigger. Also made with hardwood stocks I believe. Cost new was $110. Adj. choke on barrel. Hope this provides you with some info.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by mauser9 View Post
    Can only provide a little info Box as I not longer own my Ted Williams 200. Purchased mine in 10/72 and from paper work I discovered S/N was P1344XX. No idea of barrel code however. Mine did have walnut stock and forearm with nickel plated trigger. Also made with hardwood stocks I believe. Cost new was $110. Adj. choke on barrel. Hope this provides you with some info.
    Thanks for the information. Was it new when you purchased it ? Your serial number should place it in 1967-68, The nickel plated trigger was on 1964-1967 68models Unless it was new old stock. Well like I stated before I am forming a data base and I could be completely wrong in my assumptions. So far I have over 50 different serial numbers and barrel codes and they have all fit my theory. Yours would be the first that has not fallen into my data. Thankyou for the input I will have to collect at least 50 more serial number and barrel codes to get a definate conclusion. I wish some retired Winchester employees who built these Winchester 1200/1400, Sears 200/300, Sears TW 200/300 and Westernfield 240's , and other store guns would lend there expertise. Because the Winchester historians are clueless and do no research on these later modeled Winchesters. I looked on there official model history and they do not even list the Model 40 automatic shotgun 1939-42 and the model 1400 1964-67, 1400 MK II 1968-72, 1500XTRS 1978-82, I had to call the historian last year because they had no mention of these models, and they still do not. I guess they just sit on thier rear ends all day . Once again thankyou for your input and please anyone else with Ted Williams 200/300's please feel free to contribute.
    Last edited by box20022; 10-20-2013 at 04:32 AM.

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    Yes I purchased it brand new in 72. Don't doubt your records as mine could have been lying around in stock at a distributor or at Sears for a while.

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    There are many variables to be sorted out as you know. Is the barrel original to the reciever , new old stock as you stated, etc. I bought a Model 300 with a 15XXX SN from an owner who claimed it only fired single shot I purchased it for under $100 when i looked at the barrel it was a TW200 barrel dated mid 1966 so anything can happen ! I eventually dated the reciever to mid 1964.
    It appears that they made approximately 160,000 TW300's in 15 years in 12/20 & yes even 16 gauge about 10,000 TW 300's a year, and aproximately 80,000 TW 200's per year in 12/20/16 gauge up until 1974 when sales or production appear to have been cut dramatically because I have not seen a TW200 with a serial number in the 400,000 range. I am guessing sales slumped dramatically for the TW200 after 1974 until production ceased and Sears discontinued the Ted Williams line in 1978 and all firearm sales in 1982.
    One thing I have noticed is that you rarely see a beaten up TW200/300 I guess the owners took great pride and kept great care of them as opposed to the Sears branded 200/300's which always appear beaten up when I see them up for sale. Once again Ted Williams 200/300 owners feel free to contribute to the data base.
    Last edited by box20022; 10-23-2013 at 06:11 AM.

  24. #24
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    Rest assured the Ted Williams Model 200 I purchased in 1972 was brand new and the barrel was original to the receiver. I never made any changes such as barrel replacement. Serial no. of P1344xx is indeed correct as I have located my paperwork. I have more info on the second one I purchased as I have located my records on the gun. I purchased the same Model 1200 in 11/74 brand new and the serial no. was P2698xx. Price on this one was $154.99. I do recall the stock was walnut but the trigger on the second gun was not nickel plated. Hope this helps your research and be assured I never swap barrels or make any changes. Like keeping everything original. Look forward to hearing from you.

  25. #25
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    Weren't some Sears guns made by High Standard?
    ct

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    Yes you are correct 7x57. In fact my friend had one of these bought used back in late 60s. These were very solid with steel receiver I believe. Not sure what year it was produced. Believe High Standard made em for Sears before Winchester.

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    Oh no Mauser I was not insinuating you swapped barrels I was just relating a story that happened to me. I really appreciate your input and am thankful for you taking the time to assist me . And I think you are correct when you state that theTW 200/300's may have sat on the shelf or in a warehouse for an extended period of time before being purchased. I just added a TW200 to my data base that was close in the SN you gave me to your first TW200 mine was P1418XX with EN on the barrel and it dates to 05/1968 if I am correct in my hypothesis. And your latest SN you purchased in 11/74 places according to my theory its MFG date to around 10/72 . I will wait for another fifty or so entries before I make a definitive conclusion . Thankyou once again for your help .
    Last edited by box20022; 10-24-2013 at 06:24 PM.

  28. #28
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    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	710965Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	710967I believe you are correct I own a Ted Williams model 75 in 20 gauge with no Serial Number yet I know it has to be 1964 or after because Ted Williams name was not added to Sears items until 1964. The 1964 early Ted Williams branded firearms have the Ted Williams name printed instead of the signature scroll found on later models. I have a low SN Ted Williams T3 .22 rifle with the printed scroll like that, the T3 was actually a Winchester Model 190/290 depending on which stock it was clothed in . My Ted Williams Model 75 has the printed Ted Williams Barrel scroll on it with a chrome trigger and 3 shot 2+1 capacity . The Model 75 was actually a High Standard Supermatic Model C200. The Ted Williams 200/300's I believe are all Winchester made. As you can tell I am somewhat a Ted Williams groupie.

    I just figured out how to upload photos. The middle picture is actually my Model 75.
    Last edited by box20022; 10-24-2013 at 09:32 PM.

  29. #29
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    Glad to assist box. Just glad I kept my paperwork on all weapons I possessed. Done my share of trading and my first Ted Williams 200 was stolen. Hence my buying another. Cheaper than a Remington 870 back then but I eventually ended with an Winchester 1300 Upland which is similar to the 1200 line I believe. hope the extractor holds up. Heard that can be a weak spot. Guess the TW 200s were Ok just not built the same as the Win. Model 12 but production costs were high on this model.

  30. #30
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    The High Standard question got me to look over my TW Model 75 and I found a two letter barrel code "LH" on it now if my theory is correct that would date that model as 12/62. But that would mean Ted Williams name was used on firearms before 1964 which is quite possible because I did read an old article in an early 1962 Sports Illustrated that stated he was signed by Sears in early 1962 so maybe they slapped his name on this Model 75 before 1964. I know they dropped J.C. Higgins in 1962 as I have a few of the J.C. Higgins Model 66 Shotguns which are High Standard C-1200's one with Barrel code "FC" which would be 06/57 and my other Model 66 whose adjustable choke is similar to my TW 200/300's and Model 75 yet has no barrel code but I traced the model number to 1962 probably the end of the J.C Higgins run and the Ted Williams startup. The J.C. Higgins 66 started production in 1955 which would be the letter "A" in my theory. Once again all speculation.
    Last edited by box20022; 10-25-2013 at 01:25 AM.

  31. #31
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    Default Theory almost verified

    I just took a look at my last Sears firearm an early Ted Williams T3 .22 cal rifle which is actually a Winchester 190/290 depending on the stock, plain on 190, fancy on 290. The Serial Number on that one is 611XX and I found a barrel code on the right side closest to the reciever with the letters "HK" which would be 08/65. So I guess my theory could be Sears wide. I have no other Sears J.C. Higgins, or Ted Williams branded firearms though . Anyone out there feel free to contribute.

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    Well only thing I can add is I owned a bolt action .410 I bought from a friend back in 1967 or 68 I know. He bought it from Sears and I believe it was stamped J.C. Higgins so might have been built by Mossberg perhaps. Don't know of High Standard making bolt action shotguns. Thanks for photo of your High Standard it brought back memories of a friends pump action Ted Williams built by High Standard. Don't recall the Model no. though.

  33. #33
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    Is there a two letter barrel code on that J.C. Higgins .410 ?

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    Wish I could tell you but that was one I sold when I upgraded to other guns. Good luck with your research.

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    To close out my Sears Ted Williams Barrel code theory . I believe High Standard incorporated the practice and started with J.C. Higgins branded High Standard models sold by Sears 1955 which carried on in most Sears firearms . The code goes as follows the first letter would be the month of MFG with "A" though "L" , "A" would be January, "B" February up through "L" for December, and the second letter would represent the year of MFG "A" through "X" , "A" would be 1955 up through "X" being 1978. I am guessing this is how High Standard coded thier barrels also. Please feel free to add or correct any information or data that I have placed. Have a great Thanksgiving, and Merry Christmas to all, and to all a Happy New Year !!

  36. #36
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    I think the store brands are a great way to get solid field guns for half - or less - price of the name brand. I have several Stevens pump shotguns sold by Sears (JC Higgins) and Wards (Western Field) that are essentially Stevens 520-30 and 620A. Built like tanks and easy to work on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rudybolla View Post
    I think the store brands are a great way to get solid field guns for half - or less - price of the name brand. I have several Stevens pump shotguns sold by Sears (JC Higgins) and Wards (Western Field) that are essentially Stevens 520-30 and 620A. Built like tanks and easy to work on.
    The ones produced by High Standard and Stevens were solid built as my friend had a High Standard shotgun. Mine was a Model 200 by Winchester as I have stated to box 20022 with aluminum receiver but as you state the price was right. Price back in 72 was $110 for a new one. Not bad for a huntin gun but no Model 12.

  38. #38
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    I turned this JC Higgins Model 102.25 into a faux Stevens 520-30 trench gun. I had it parkerized like the ones refurbed for Vietnam. It has a 1960s vintage M17 bayonet made specifically for the trench guns.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails full.JPG   520-30inVietnam.jpg  

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    This is a Zombie thread, but what the hey. The cannon breech shotgun is a Hopkins and Allen manufactured between 1909 and 1915.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron J View Post
    This is a Zombie thread, but what the hey. The cannon breech shotgun is a Hopkins and Allen manufactured between 1909 and 1915.
    "Sometimes They Come Back"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron J View Post
    This is a Zombie thread, but what the hey. The cannon breech shotgun is a Hopkins and Allen manufactured between 1909 and 1915.
    Thankyou for the Cannon Breech information. Mine has a Serial Number "Q5955". I have seen other posters who posted their Serial Numbers but some of them had a different letter before the start of the serial numbers which I cannot figure out. How did you come across this information so I can use this resource in the future? By the way if anyone knows where I can obtain a firing pin and firing pin spring for that Cannon Breech I would be greatly in debted to them.

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    I recently traded for a '73(?) Ted Williams 20ga, 3" chamber, in near mint condition. Whatever else can be said for/about this gun; it's a nice looking gun and appears to be very solid & well made.. Like most others I hate to pay more than I need to for anything; including guns. This gun looks like it would do anything I needed it to do... I'm glad to have it.....!
    An Armed man is a Citizen. An Unarmed man is a Subject.

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    I traded for one of these recently and I'm glad to have it. Seems like a great gun and very attractive.
    An Armed man is a Citizen. An Unarmed man is a Subject.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stevehandley View Post
    I traded for one of these recently and I'm glad to have it. Seems like a great gun and very attractive.
    Glad to see this thread still alive. I two had a couple of these and commented in above posts. Currently have a Win. 1300 Upland which is similar to the T/W 200 series with aluminum receiver and it has seen a lot of use. Nice and light for Upland hunting and doubles for deer with buckshot but it does kick.

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