Results 1 to 20 of 20
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    S. Fla
    Posts
    229

    Default Pyrodex vs Black Powder

    I was wondering if someone, who has real experience, tell me about the difference between Pyrodex and BP. I have a .36 cal 1851 Navy (Pietta) and I use Pyrodex as it is all I can find locally in FFF. I am looking at a half stock .32 caliber percussion kit. I have read that a good starting point is 1 grain for every caliber. Is that different for Pyrodex. I know when I get the kit the instruction manual will have some information, but the pistol does not manual does not differentiate between the two. Do I really need to go on line and order black powder and pay the hazardous material shipping fee (ouch)? Thanks.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    2,356

    Default

    Pyrodex is exactly interchangable in volume for black powder.
    It is conciderably different in density so don't translate this to mean it is interchangable by weight, it isn't.
    I have found that its a little harder to ignite, this doesn't matter most of the time, but if you have a cylinder breech you'll notice a real difference in ignition time.
    When the entire world is PO'd at you maybe its you, not the whole world that has the problem!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    South metro Atlanta area.
    Posts
    2,433

    Default

    I've been buying BP at Bass Pro shops for the last 2 years. It runs about $28/lb with tax. I just decided to go ahead and order my first online BP and received it last week. Even with 5 lbs, I would save a little and 25 pounds much more but I went for 10 lbs and got it for $18.30/lb shipped including everything. I use Goex.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    674

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by plonker View Post
    I have found that its a little harder to ignite, this doesn't matter most of the time, but if you have a cylinder breech you'll notice a real difference in ignition time.
    Personal experience with traditional sidelock is that pyrodex is more hydroscopic, not a big problem on the range but results in misfires when hunting on damp mornings.
    "Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.
    Unknown, often attributed to Mark Twain

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    1,482

    Default

    I've had good results with Pyrodex RS in BP cartridge rifles, but in my experience in muzzleloaders, Pyrodex seems to be more sensitive to differences in compression and is somewhat harder to ignite than BP. It is also harder to clean, imho, than BP.
    Hodgdon publishes Pyrodex data.
    I just received a shipment of BP from Grafs--even after the Hazmat fee it worked out to a little over $18 a pound. It certainly is cheaper in quantity, so if you can, find another shooter in your area to split a shipment. You'll be pleased with BP overall.
    Last edited by FGD135; 03-11-2013 at 12:45 PM.
    Sam Cummings laughs at us from the grave!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    206

    Default

    Won't work with flintlocks

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Eastern England
    Posts
    1,243

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jbw View Post
    Won't work with flintlocks
    +1, The flash point of Pyrodex is nearly double that of black powder.
    ukrifleman.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    2,646

    Default

    I am a little confused on amounts of pyrodex, after all, my cabela's load data booklet shows less pyrodex than blackpowder, like pyrodex is more powerful seemingly. Haven't done a lot of shooting of blackpowder guns yet, just one instance a week ago my 1858 pietta .44, seems like I remember 28gr max of pyrodex

  9. #9
    Clyde's Avatar
    Clyde is online now Gold Bullet Member and Noted Curmudgeon
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    East Texas
    Posts
    57,029

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AndGunsForAll View Post
    I am a little confused on amounts of pyrodex, after all, my cabela's load data booklet shows less pyrodex than blackpowder, like pyrodex is more powerful seemingly. Haven't done a lot of shooting of blackpowder guns yet, just one instance a week ago my 1858 pietta .44, seems like I remember 28gr max of pyrodex
    The reason for that is listed above.

    Pyrodex is designed and formulated to be a VOLUME FOR VOLUME substitute for BP. One cc of Pryrodex of the same granulation will provide the same performance (including pressure) as one cc of BP. BUT - the one cc of BP will weigh more than one cc of Pyrodex. If you do a weight-for weight substitution, you will run the pressures up a LOT with the Pyrodex load.

    Where confusion often comes is most BP powder measures are marked in grains (weight) rather than volume. But the way to make it work is set you measure to throw the desired BP charge in your favored granulation, then use it to throw the Pyrodex charges without concern for the weight of the Pyrodx charge.

    IF you want to throw by weight, then establish the VOLUME of BP at the desired weight. Then throw that same volume of Pyrodex on your scale and record the weight. And use that weight.
    Absent comrades (sound of breaking glass)

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Illinois USA
    Posts
    2,575

    Default

    When using sub powders, I don't weigh anything. I simply set my black powder measure to...let's say 32 grains for the sake of this thread, and pour the charge. Where I make a mistake is when I tell someone what I'm shooting. Because I'm using a set measured charge I often say X number of grains fff or ff and forget to mention "by volume".

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    The Arizona Territory
    Posts
    8,413

    Default

    In addition to all my .44 Remingtons, Colts, and ROA, I have a .36 Remington & grew up with Dad's 1861 Navy. Between 25 & 30 grains of either Black or Pyrodex P in the .44's & 23-25 in the .36 , I really can't see any significant difference. Both are plenty accurate.

    I use black more often, but Pyrodex P at the same powder measure volume performs just fine.
    "Hey Look! We've got Guns ... and We've got Snacks!"
    - Cdr. Samuel "Sam" Axe, USN, (ret) -

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    midwest
    Posts
    1,768

    Default

    Pyrodex is unholy.

  13. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Pyrodex is unholy.
    Well, that's a little harsh. Pyrodex is corrosive. But it's often easier to find than real powder since a lot of places don't want to fool with the license for real powder.

    Buy online or bulk. Or if you have some place local that carries powder count yourself lucky. The sports store near me in the city doesn't. And the LGS doesn't even think muzzle loaders still exist.

    The place at the outfitter's store in the upstate by the family farm has substitute but no real powder.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    382

    Default

    I would add two things to the discussion, first and most important to me, Pyrodex does not seem to store well, especially after the can is opened, while black, stored under the same conditions as pyrodex, does not deteriorate. The pyro was harder to ignite then when new (an opened but sealed can) and did not seem as powerfull. Pyrodex also, to me, seems to leave more residue in nooks and crannies, while black residue flushes off with soap and water. My experience, and it is old, I have not used pyrodex since the 1990's so the formula may have changed for the better.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Congo, DR
    Posts
    1,136

    Default

    Pyrodex is unholy.

    Essentially a truism to those who are members of the Holy Black brigade.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    The Arizona Territory
    Posts
    8,413

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Pyrodex is unholy.
    If that be the case, then all those replica firearms are Satan's Spawn. They're foreign knockoffs, UnAmerican and have no place on the firing line. If you can't afford an original, then you'd best go buy an in-line or shoot modern firearms


    ...Otherwise... Use what you can afford and whatever is available to you.
    "Hey Look! We've got Guns ... and We've got Snacks!"
    - Cdr. Samuel "Sam" Axe, USN, (ret) -

  17. #17
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Ammon, NC
    Posts
    1,060

    Default

    I have used both. Pyrodex in the granulated form seems to work much better than the pellets. It is harder to ignite and I guess that is one reason many in-lines use 209 primers and Winchester has a relatively new Magnum #11 cap. I have to agree, if you can get it, I believe BP is the better propellant but that is just my opinion. I too order my BP from Graf and Sons. When it is in stock I buy a bunch and now that they will let you mix BP, smokeless, primers and caps all in one shipment for one HazMat fee I am pleased as a hog in slop!

    Dave
    Dave

    In 100 years who of us will care?
    An armed society is a polite society!
    Just because they say you are paranoid doesn't mean they are not out to get you.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Springfield OR
    Posts
    212

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Pyrodex is unholy.
    Unless it is not possible to get black, it is surely a huge sin to something else. Black powder guns are meant to shoot Holy Black Powder!!

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    The Arizona Territory
    Posts
    8,413

    Default

    Check out this link: http://1858remington.com/discuss/ind...ic,4733.0.html It has some interesting data about BP & Pyrodex performance. It also mentions that Pyrodex can be compressed more than BP, so you can get a little hotter maximum revolver load; otherwise at identical uncompressed volumes, BP still holds the edge for more power.
    "Hey Look! We've got Guns ... and We've got Snacks!"
    - Cdr. Samuel "Sam" Axe, USN, (ret) -

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    213

    Default

    Unless it is not possible to get black, it is surely a huge sin to something else. Black powder guns are meant to shoot Holy Black Powder!!.
    I agree Blackpowder guns should use Black Powder. If you must use Pyrodex measure it is by volume not weight! If you use the same charge by weight you are going to destroy your firearm. Pyrodex is lighter than Black, harder to ignite and does seem to wick moisture out of the air. Order online!!!!!!!!!! Do a Google search on Black powder

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •