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  1. #1
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    Default Turkish 38/46 Short Rifle. Picked it up today.

    Found one at a local gunstore priced at $100 even. Hasn't been bubba'd at all, bore looks unfired. Stock looks like it has a thin coat of shellac with the rack number of 14. It's marked K.Kale 1945. Good deal?

    I picked it up today, only real problem with it is that the a small setback in the recoil lug has knocked out a couple small chunk of wood. Bore is pretty much brand new, nothing except the barrel, sights and receiver match, stock maybe original to it. Did the Turks use shellac on their rifles?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails tm45.jpg   tm452.jpg   tm453.jpg   tm454.jpg  
    Last edited by GeorgeA; 03-25-2013 at 06:13 PM.

  2. #2
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    Personally I'd go for it.
    Will trade a German used and marked, all matching (by the Germans), good condition, M95M with original German added French sling for a M95 sniper.
    Looking for unusual, Czech, and 1913 or earlier M95s and early Czech 98/22s (Vz 98).
    Just running along ... at a tortoise pace. I'm just too busy and too slow.
    You can view pics of my collection here.

  3. #3
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    Buy it they arn't as common as m38 long rifles.

  4. #4
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    Jump on it fast! I used to own a 38/46 with Imperial G98 parts.

  5. #5
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    Buy it, especially with a good bore. I've never seen a Turk short rifle with a good bore...
    Remember-Gun control is not about guns, it's about control.

  6. #6
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    +1 my 38/46 cannot hit the broad side of a barn from inside the barn. The bore is basically smooth.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrench View Post
    Buy it, especially with a good bore. I've never seen a Turk short rifle with a good bore...
    ^^^ This, especially at that price.
    Damn the expense, use your turn signals today... and as a special favour, try doing it before you have two wheels in the next lane.

  8. #8
    rocker98's Avatar
    rocker98 is offline Diamond with Gold Oak Clusters and Swords Bullet Member
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    Yes! Buy it! http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...ked-up-a-38-46

    I took mine to the range with gunhorde and the bore looks quite impressive after 40 rounds. Blew out a lot of gunk in the groves. A little rounded on top, but well pronounced and sharp lands. Quite the fire ball, and a real nice shooter.

    For $100, if it looks as good as you say, I don't think you can go wrong.
    Gary


    ***WARNING*** Mosins breed like rabbits!

    "In shallow men the fish of little thoughts cause much commotion. In oceanic minds the whales of inspiration make hardly a ruffle." SRI PARAMHANSA YOGANANDA

    A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have. Gerald R. Ford

    "You are never dead, as long as you are remembered"


  9. #9
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    I forgot to mention that the bolt appears to be Imperial German and checkered/flat knob

  10. #10
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    Dec 1969
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    Like I said George my has a Imperial German floorplate

  11. #11
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    Dec 1969
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    Brisbane, Australia
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    Kirikkale Short Rifle, ,made 1945, so it cannot be a "38/46"!!!! ( who-ever thought up that designation had no clue.!). K'Kale SRs were made from 1944 to 1946, about 15,000 made all up on this period.

    There are also several other "Short Rifles" in the Turkish Inventory: The M1903/37SR, the M98/37 SR, the
    M98a/37SR, and a second series of M98/38 SR These are all in 7,9mm; There are also others, such as the M88/05/2x? SR, and some 7,65mm M1903/2x?SR as well. Finally there is the Post-War refurbished Kar98k (SR) fitted with underneath sling swivels. ( German Interned Rifles, 1944-45).

    All the SRs are relatively rare, as only 5,000 to 15,000 of each variety were made (AFAIK, from Serial # surveys on Parallax Curio & Relic Turkish Board)

    Regards,
    Doc AV

  12. #12
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    So how'd I do guys? I think I fixed the recoil bolt issue for now, just waiting to shoot it

  13. #13
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    Dec 1969
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    You did fabulously well, you dog...
    Remember-Gun control is not about guns, it's about control.

  14. #14
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    Apr 2010
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    Apparently i never really fixed the recoil issue. This happened after firing 30 rounds through it a couple weeks ago, a thin layer of wood came off by the recoil lug. How should I handle this?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails turk4.jpg  

  15. #15
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    Sep 2012
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    Had a similar issue with my k98. I pushed the piece of wood back into place that was sheared off by the setback of the cross bolt. Then I used a drill press to drill a small hole cross ways through the realigned wood. I then pushed epoxy into the hole followed by a small machine bolt and tightened it all together with a nut on the opposite side of the stock. I then drilled two vertical holes through the wood just in front of the new cross bolt and screwed two small wood screws in vertically under the barrel lug between the new crossbolt and the recoil cross bolt to cinch the wood together in the opposite direction. Hasn't moved again yet. The cross bolt may be a little unsightly but I thank it will definitely stay put now. Can see the new cross bolt in these photos.Click image for larger version. 

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  16. #16
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    I think the 38/46 designation for the 38 Short rifle came from Olsons "Mauser bolt Rifles".At the time I belive there was only 1 Short rifle in an collection in Ohio that was used for the Picture in Olsons book.I think it is dated 1946 ,Hence the designation at the time.This was all before the other books and internet so it was only "Mauser bolt rifles" as the Main reference at the time.I have seen the Short rifle in Olsons book in person and it is New-brand new.This was also before any Of the 38 turkish rifles started to come in or any of the "38/46 or 38 SR were imported.I have a lot of respect for Doc's vast knoweldge and Olsons book but just my .02 on where the 38/46 came from.Nice rifle,BTW,there are no 100 anythings now Mauser or Mosin Nagant.Check out the Turk mauser website for more great info on Receivers,barrels and all things Turk mauser.
    The Truth is Concrete-Bertolt Brecht
    While much is too strange to be believed,nothing is too strange to have happened-Thomas Hardy

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betonfahrer View Post
    I think the 38/46 designation for the 38 Short rifle came from Olsons "Mauser bolt Rifles".At the time I belive there was only 1 Short rifle in an collection in Ohio that was used for the Picture in Olsons book.I think it is dated 1946 ,Hence the designation at the time.This was all before the other books and internet so it was only "Mauser bolt rifles" as the Main reference at the time.I have seen the Short rifle in Olsons book in person and it is New-brand new.This was also before any Of the 38 turkish rifles started to come in or any of the "38/46 or 38 SR were imported.I have a lot of respect for Doc's vast knoweldge and Olsons book but just my .02 on where the 38/46 came from.Nice rifle,BTW,there are no 100 anythings now Mauser or Mosin Nagant.Check out the Turk mauser website for more great info on Receivers,barrels and all things Turk mauser.
    I just bought a 1945 K. Kale M38 short rifle and wondered why they were called M38/46s. I did some searching and couldn't find much. Sounds like 38/46 is actually a misnomer unless they were cut down from long rifles but that wouldn't explain the serial number range.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mwt View Post
    The cross bolt may be a little unsightly but I thank it will definitely stay put now. Can see the new cross bolt in these photos.Click image for larger version. 

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    Sorry, but its overkill. The problem isn't the original crossbolt but the wood around it. I'd guess the wood right around the original crossbolt is soft and maybe rotting and some thin epoxy like GitsRot would cure it, along with bedding the recoil lug in Accraglas.
    I swear by Jupiter Optimus Maximus .... in the army of the consul Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus and for 10 miles around it I will not steal anything worth more than a sestertius in any one day.

  19. #19
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    Dec 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrench View Post
    Buy it, especially with a good bore. I've never seen a Turk short rifle with a good bore...
    Surprising. I had the same opinion of Turk short rifles (and most of the long ones, too) until just last Sunday.

    On Sunday I picked up a Turk 03-38 (98-38?) short rifle (also marked 1945 K.Kale, by the way) with what I consider an UNBELIEVABLY good bore. It passed the bullet test (using my 'hard' test bullet. it is .3215 measured at the case mouth Czech round. I have an 'easy' (.3225") round in my checkout kit as well ) with better than 1/4 inch out. It has an unworn throat, and the bore is bright and shiny, with sharp rifling.

    There was LOTS of copper in that bore, but not any more (after about four royal blue patches using foaming bore cleaner, they were greyish-white). Patches are still coming out a medium grey, but each patch is definitely lighter than the previous one. It is getting there.

    The bore has a LITTLE bit of 'funk' in the center 20% of the grooves about 3 inches back from the muzzle (and it is blindingly bright EVERYWHERE else.), but the more I brush it, the less funk there is. I figure it will probably all go away when I clean it after firing a few rounds through it.

    The stock was nice, with light scratches and only a few minor dings. The bolt face is clean, with no sign of a 'primer ring'. There was a small Navy Arms (NA) import mark at the muzzle.

    My normal guess for an issued rifle in this condition is that it was either issued to a cook or to the company clerk. Certainly not issued to a grunt.

    The receiver and all the rear sight parts are all matching, but the barrel, bolt, and trigger guard do not match. The extractor fits a little loose, but this is no biggie, and there is no evidence yet that it will not do its job.

    I got it for $150 out the door (sticker price was $200), and generally consider any '98 Mauser' in this condition, no matter what its origin, a steal at that price.

    It was actually my consolation prize after passing up a (can you call them nice?) garden variety RC K98 with the standard matching EP marks, and a completely unmarred coat of shellac that was on the same table for a $250 'quoted' price (300 on the sticker and the guy said 250 immediately when I stopped).

    I passed it by with every intention of coming back 20 minutes later to buy it after I walked the rest of the show. Long story short, it was gone 20 minutes later. I didn't even consider looking at the Turk until the RC was gone. I am glad I did.
    Last edited by Ronbo6; 05-14-2013 at 11:21 PM.

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