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  1. #1
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    Default Coop - Schultz & Larsen Rifle

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    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member
    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/19/2005 : 8:23:02 PM
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    HI i have just purchased A RIFLE IN 6.5/55, on the barrel is the name Shultz&LARSen , the action is a 98mauser the barrel is a target grade with a front tunnel sight and rear peep sight and stock is military but no timber on top of the barrel,what is good load for this type of rifle. I have never loaded rifle ammunition and would like to give it a go,also any information on Shultz&Larsen
    Thanks COOP

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    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member
    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/20/2005 : 12:36:35 AM
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    Hi coop,
    From your description, the rifle you have may be a Danish built target rifle. The 98 action and Schultz & Larsen barrel were a popular combination there in the 1950s and 1960s. Parker-Hale target sights were also used in Denmark, but without pictures or more description, I don't know what your sights would be.

    I would highly recommend that you get one of the good reloading manuals put out by Sierra, Hornady, Speer, or Vihtavuori. A good load for your rifle can depend on a lot of variables, e.g., twist rate, bullet type, bullet weight, etc. Target rifles generally will like the 140 grain and heavier bullets.

    Schultz and Larsen was founded in 1889 to build ultra high quality target rifles. Over the decades S & L has gained a well earned reputation for building some of the finest target and hunting rifles in the world. The Schultz and Larsen bolt action is one of the strongest designs and some early Weatherby magnum rifles were actually built by S & L. The company also produced barrels for target rifles that are highly regarded by international competitors and many world record shooting rifles have been fitted with S & L barrels. Even Pettson will tell you how great these barrels are. If built correctly, the combination you have is a very fine rifle. If you can post some pictures that would be great.

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    kriggevær

    larsluthor
    Gunboards Premium Member
    USA
    248 Posts
    Posted - 05/20/2005 : 02:29:17 AM
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    Second what he said...not as well marketed as bigger named rifles but equal or better to any of the fine target rifles made for long distance shooting.. and you have one of the better old cartridges that has inherent accuracy....be sure to run a tight patch thru your bore and mark the rod and then push until you get an exact single revolution.. measure the distance between the two marks and you will have the twist rate...this will help to determine what bullet weights are more ideal for whatever ranges, game etc you want to use this rifle for...I am guessing it also has a target style trigger, check to see what make etc..
    you have an oldie but goodie...
    lars


    Umimmak Torulleq
    Gunboards Premium Member
    Denmark
    104 Posts
    Posted - 05/20/2005 : 09:31:30 AM
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    There isn't much to ad. Galen and Lars actually said it all. S&L can be considered the rifles answer to B&O or something like that. For at targetrifle I doubt that you can get anything better than a swedish mauser with S&Lbarrel and perhaps also a S&Ltrigger. I once asked the best targetshooter in North Europe what she considered to be the best, and she answered that a S&L barrel easily takes 10.000 shots before it needs replacements, compared to modern german Sauers who needs to be changed after only 4.000 rounds. Doesn't this say all?

    Best Umimmak Torulleq
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    Umimmak Torulleq


    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member
    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/20/2005 : 10:20:27 AM
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    Thank you gentleman for your information about my rifle,I hope to fit a scope to rifle as i would like to shoot the F Class Match,this calibre of rifle should be ok out to 500metre,Hope to have some photo's soon,thanks again for your help
    regards COOP


    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member
    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/20/2005 : 5:14:35 PM
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    quote:
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    Originally posted by coop

    Thank you gentlemen for your information about my rifle,I hope to fit a scope to rifle as i would like to shoot the F Class Match,this calibre of rifle should be ok out to 500metre,Hope to have some photo's soon,thanks again for your help
    regards COOP

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    Robinpeck
    Gunboards Premium Member
    Canada
    185 Posts
    Posted - 05/23/2005 : 4:59:28 PM
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    I haven't seen the Mauser 98 S+L barelled versions of the Schultz & Larsen rifle, but the rifles they imported into North America, many for Sharpe and Hart cartridges were nearly always incredibly heavy and awkward rifles...you see used ones for sale around here all the time...the owners usually want a lot for them, and usually don't get it.


    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member
    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/23/2005 : 9:03:47 PM
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    The Model 54J was the first hunting rifle model built by S&L and was chambered for the 7x61 Sharpe&Hart Norma factory loading, which was quite hot. The M56A action was also chosen by Roy Weatherby for the .378 Weatherby Magnum, which, even nowadays, is one of the heavier recoiling rifles around. Without a scope IIRC these rifles weighed in around 8-9 pounds. In the Weatherby chambering the weight was seen as an advantage in taming the recoil. The 56A action was over engineered to be certain. From the M54J and 56A rifles, S&L continued developing and changing the rifle through several models M60,65,68, etc. arriving at a hunting rifle weighing in around 7.5 pounds. The current M97 rifle is also in the 7-7.5 range. My S&L Model 65 with Leupold 3.4x10-40 scope weighs in just at eight pounds.
    In regard to Coop's rifle, many Mauser 98 actions were actually converted by S&L at the Otterup factory at the same time that individual gunsmiths were rebarreling M98 and M96 rifles with S&L barrels and triggers for civilian use. Can't wait for his photos

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    kriggevær


    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member
    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/24/2005 : 01:09:27 AM
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    THANKS again gentlemen for your impute into Shultz & Larsen,I'am waiting on paper work from our FIREARMS REGISTRY so i can pick the rifle up,
    regards ALAN


    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member



    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 05:52:20 AM
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    HI gentlemen a couple photos of the 6.5/55 Shultz&Larsen,just waiting on paperwork so i can pick her up, any more information will be appreciated
    regards COOP
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    Edited by - coop on 05/26/2005 8:34:43 PM


    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 08:07:17 AM
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    Hi Coop,
    From what I can see in the pictures, your rifle looks like it is a Norwegian built K98 target rifle. That looks like a Hauges diopter. Regardless, of whether it is Norwegian or Danish, it is probably going to be a great rifle. Have fun with it!

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    kriggevær

    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."



    Pettson
    Swedish Civilian Firearms Board Moderator



    Sweden
    557 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 2:59:26 PM
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    And I'll second that, I think it might be a Norwegian match rifle. Got any full view pictures?

    Pettson

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    "There are no prospects for a man who is still disliked by the age of forty."
    - Confucius -
    - - -
    "What appears quite credible to me, who know a great deal about guns, is often received sceptically by those who only think they know about guns."
    - Robert Churchill -
    - - -
    "Good girls go to heaven. Bad girls go to hell. And girls on fast bikes go anywhere they want."
    - Elena Filatova -
    www.elenafilatova.com


    Robinpeck
    Gunboards Premium Member



    Canada
    185 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 6:27:07 PM
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    I thought this was a Swedish site...whats next....the Sako rabble!!!???


    Pettson
    Swedish Civilian Firearms Board Moderator



    Sweden
    557 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 7:32:04 PM
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    Well, since both Norway and Finland used to be under Swedish reign, and we're beating the danes by 4-1 or so in major battles won, I reckon all Scandinavian guns would be welcome here...

    Pettson

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    "There are no prospects for a man who is still disliked by the age of forty."
    - Confucius -
    - - -
    "What appears quite credible to me, who know a great deal about guns, is often received sceptically by those who only think they know about guns."
    - Robert Churchill -
    - - -
    "Good girls go to heaven. Bad girls go to hell. And girls on fast bikes go anywhere they want."
    - Elena Filatova -
    www.elenafilatova.com

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    Edited by - Pettson on 05/26/2005 7:32:44 PM


    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member



    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 7:34:14 PM
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    HI i a apologize for using the wrong sight, as i'am new to GUNBOARDS,and having being told that the rifle was Swedish made by the bloke who sold it to me, and not having any knowledge of this type of rifle i believed i was on the right site sorry for the mistake,also like thank the other gentlemen for their input helping me identifying the rifle.
    regards COOP

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    Edited by - coop on 05/27/2005 09:54:56 AM


    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 8:32:15 PM
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    Hi Coop,
    No apologies necessary, you are on the right forum It was only with the advent of the Christianization of Scandinavia, starting around 1100 A.D., that there was much differentiation between nationalities. The royal families of the three countries were so intertwined, it was not very important whether there was a Dane, Swede, or Norwegian sitting on the throne. Well, at least until the Hanseatic League and Sweden started fooling around with the Germans. And if Denmark hadn't picked the wrong side during the Napoleonic wars, well things might have been different into the 20th century, maybe. Even when Norway gained its independence, they turned around and elected a Danish prince to be their king.
    And yes, Sweden is the "big brother" of Scandinavia and looks fondly on its little brothers to the south and west. But, for little brothers, Norway and Denmark do quite well for themselves. And the Swedes have always been a little jealous that Victor Borge was a Dane and that a Dane invented the Vice-Grip pliers, but that is another story. When it comes to Scandinavian firearms, either military or civilian, the relationships are complex and incestuous among the designers and manufacturers of the three countries. And, the people of the three countries all share very Norse traits of being fiercely independent and stubborn to a fault. So, even though they sometimes hate to admit it, the various nationalities are probably more alike than they are different. Well, maybe, I still don't understand why the Norwegians eat lutefisk og lefsa, especially when Denmark produces the best pork in the world.

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    kriggevær

    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."



    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/26/2005 : 11:09:45 PM
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    Back Again! I think I misidentified the diopter. That is probably a KV (Kongsberg) diopter.

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    kriggevær

    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."



    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member



    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 12:56:51 AM
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    HI Kriggevaer when i pick the rifle up from the gun dealer in few weeks time, I will get back to the site let you know how the rifle went at the range,The rear sight on the rifle, are they common for this type of rifle.Thanks for the history and geography lesson,you always learn something new each day, VICTOR BORGE great piano player and comedian
    regards COOP


    Umimmak Torulleq
    Gunboards Premium Member



    Denmark
    104 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 07:48:37 AM
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    WHAT?

    Pettson you are absolutely wrong! At least I would like to see some kind of statistic proof that you should have won 4 out of 5 battles! I'm convinced it's the other way around! Besides it haven ended yet!

    And as we all know the oldest gun in Sweden is the so called Löshultsbössa from medieval times, but here you are again wrong. It is the oldest gun in Denmark since Löshult in medieval times was a part of Denmark!

    And by the way, some time ago there was a breakdown in the negotiation between swedes and norwegians, when they tried to make a fusion between their two telephone companies. They broke totally down in the end, and a norwegian later said in telly that the norwegians always saw upon the swedes as a kind of germans disguised as humans! And boy she was right!

    Well, I might have mentioned it before, but here comes one of my favorite quotes that dates back from the time when king Carl XII ( a terrible massmurdere, a sort of beast that would let Karadizc in Serbia look like a sunday school) was fighting the danish freedom fighters in Scania. First the danes allways toasted for each other, secondly for the king (the danish king of cause) and when they reached the third drink they said:

    Alle gode gange er trende,
    fan' ta' svensken gælder denne.
    Må han ta' ham og behold ham,
    flå ham, flæk ham skold ham,
    styrt ham ned i helvedsilden,
    når min snaps går ned til silden.

    I guess that at least those of you who speak scandinavian enough to understand that, liked it. Unless you are swedes of course. In a very rough translation it means something like: May the devil take the swede and cut him in halves and throw him down to the hells fire when my schnaps goes down my stomach!

    And as a further proof I also will quote our greatest writer of christain songs and inventor of the danish folkhighscools, N.F.S. Grundtvig who in 1813 said: Sweden is the servant of lie and evilness!

    That same year was also the, so far, last battle between danes and swedes fought. We were of couse victorius.

    Well didn't this say all? One day, hopefully soon, Denmark and Norway will rise again and and take back Scania and Härjedalen and perhaps repeat the stochholmian bloodbath (that was in 1520 and some 100 swedish noble men where beheaded by the danish king).

    And by the way, the danes actually are coming back to Scania. There's a huge emigration in these years and some of them are actually starting a production of firearms! Scania Firearms Company is now a reallity and will soon start making hunting rifles.

    Well, perhaps this reply set things a little more in perspective!

    As usual best regards from Umimmak Torulleq



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    Umimmak Torulleq


    Umimmak Torulleq
    Gunboards Premium Member



    Denmark
    104 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 08:28:55 AM
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    If you really want to see for yourself here is one of the almost endless series of pictures of swedes who surrender to the danes. Here it's general Stenboch who surrenders in 1713 with his 13.000 men. He is though allowed to personally give up his sword to the danish king himself. It is now on display in Copenhagen. General Stenbock died later in captivity.

    Should there still be some left who might believe that Sweden is some sort of scandinavian leader (something the swedes often like to think themselves) you hereby are made wiser. At least you should have learned something about our very special sence of humour and ironi!

    And should you wish to see more just say so because I'd gladly show more pictures of surrendering swedes!

    Best regards to you all from Umimmak Torulleq

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    Umimmak Torulleq


    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 09:58:34 AM
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    Oh Ummimak, I wasn't going to bring up Scania, but...



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    kriggevær

    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."


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    Edited by - kriggevaer on 05/27/2005 10:08:00 AM


    Balltip
    Gunboards Member



    Sweden
    11 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 1:39:25 PM
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    LOL! This history lesson is getting quite interresting! All I can say is that I got a few cannon balls (three to be precise) that I have found in my GARDEN (true) using my metal detector. Those should date from about the 17th century or so - and were most likely fired during a battle between Swede/Danish forces!
    Yes, I do happen to live on the old border between Denmark and Sweden, wich is now well inside the (current) borders of Sweden.
    Heck, once Pettson had to show one of those cannon balls to a mutual friend of ours. This at 2am in the morning (that was after a bbq and a few brewskies). He took took it in his hands, happy as a little kid, and ran upstairs to show-n-tell. And I heard how he stumbeled across the floor shouting "Hey, look here!" as he dropped that 8 pound iron ball. It landed on the poor fellas tummy! The soft thud of the cannon ball landing was accompanied by a faint voice going "oooouch!"

    I never ever been so close to laughing my head off for real!

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    Edited by - Balltip on 05/27/2005 1:41:28 PM


    Balltip
    Gunboards Member



    Sweden
    11 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 1:55:24 PM
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    (Besides; The Swede/Dane wars ain't over yet! Past monday Sweden scored another point in the ever ongoing battle as I bought a 310A 20 gauge from a dane who had absolutely no idea bout what he was selling. I got it... cheap. )


    Umimmak Torulleq
    Gunboards Premium Member



    Denmark
    104 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 1:58:35 PM
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    Well Balltip, I'm very pleased to hear that our cannonballs are stil hurting the swedes - ha-ha-ha!

    Remember a Schultz & Larsen will beat your Carl Gustafs any time!

    All the best from Umimmak Torulleq.

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    Umimmak Torulleq


    Balltip
    Gunboards Member



    Sweden
    11 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 2:08:56 PM
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    Umimmak! Just to make you happy I'll post a pic of those 3 cannon balls! And yeah, it was the big one that "hit home" at least a second time roflmao!
    The biggie measures at approx 13cm/just over 5" across.


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    kriggevaer
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



    USA
    1709 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 3:39:21 PM
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    Balltip,
    I believe that is the first time a photograph of svensk/dansk cannon balls has ever been shown on this forum. And it is also a good caution to not be in Petton's way when he is carrying cannonballs! And poor Coop, all he wanted when he started this thread was to learn about his rifle - Coop, I hope we haven't given you to bumpy of a ride -

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    kriggevær

    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."


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    Edited by - kriggevaer on 05/27/2005 3:41:32 PM


    sbhva
    Moderator



    USA
    1477 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 3:53:25 PM
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    Balltip,
    I think you should buy the helmet we have been talking about to protect yourself from flying cannonballs when Pettson comes to visit!

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    Steve




    Robinpeck
    Gunboards Premium Member



    Canada
    185 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 7:25:00 PM
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    The only part of Scandinavia I have visited is Iceland (several times)...they told me that they prefer the company of Finns to that of the Danes, Swedes or Norwegians....this because no one in the rest of real Scandinavia can understand their Ancient Norse way of speaking...so they talk to the Finns in English...and also they think that they and the Finns share the same drinking tradition. All very complex...makes me happy that I'm a simple Magyar.(Although I do understand that the Danes hired a number of Magyar cavalry as mercenaries to use in their seaborn raids against Continental Northwest Europe in the 10th c.)

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    Edited by - Robinpeck on 05/28/2005 1:45:59 PM


    coop
    Gunboards Super Premium Member



    Australia
    393 Posts
    Posted - 05/27/2005 : 11:34:37 PM
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    HI this has been a education for me, not only have i learnt about my Shultz&Larsen,but also get to see part of Scaninavian HISTORY that you don't get see on NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC channel most enjoyable
    Regards COOP


    Pettson
    Swedish Civilian Firearms Board Moderator



    Sweden
    557 Posts
    Posted - 05/28/2005 : 05:06:09 AM
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    Hmmm, interesting... I think I must add a couple of points of interest.

    1. The main reason Denmark still exists as a sovereign nation is of course thanks to the Dutch and the English Navies... None of them were interested in seeing one country having full control of the sound and thereby controlling the Baltic sea. So they did interfere a couple of times...

    2. The only reason there aren't any pictures of surrendering Danes is that when beaten the survivors ran so fast back home no-one had a chance to paint their pictures...

    3. As for tyrannical monarchs, hmmm... I kind of thought Denmark have had it's share of those...

    4. The Danes did indeed make super quality cannon balls!

    Me, I like the Icelanders and the Finns...

    And coop, sorry about the hi-jacking, you're always welcome here!

    Pettson

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "There are no prospects for a man who is still disliked by the age of forty."
    - Confucius -
    - - -
    "What appears quite credible to me, who know a great deal about guns, is often received sceptically by those who only think they know about guns."
    - Robert Churchill -
    - - -
    "Good girls go to heaven. Bad girls go to hell. And girls on fast bikes go anywhere they want."
    - Elena Filatova -
    www.elenafilatova.com

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Edited by - Pettson on 05/28/2005 09:11:36 AM


    John Wallace
    Gunboards.Com Gold Star Member



    3488 Posts
    Posted - 05/29/2005 : 06:01:02 AM
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    This sounds a bit like the question of whether the Scots are distinct from the English. The answer is usually the opposite of whatever some outsider suggests they ought to be. Personally I think being roused from sleep by an excavated cannon-ball should be considered a privilege.

    A little over thirty years ago I saturated myself in the Icelandic sagas, and I re-read Frans Bengtsson's "The Long Ships" (infinitely superior to the film) every few years. I think you are a little unfair in saying Scandinavia was christianised in 1100. I distinctly remember that Harald Bluetooth was quite a bit earlier, and I know royally sponsored missionaries came to Iceland only a little after the millennium. Of course we aren't talking Christianity as usually constituted. A missionary who loaded his crucifix with lead to beat out the brains of people disturbing his meetings, was a bit of a giveaway.

    Another of my favourite books on the subject is "The Viking Age" by the French-American Paul du Chaillu, better known as an African explorer who shot gorillas like woodchucks. (It was the Victorian age, of course, and I don't think he believed they would mind.) It has engravings of artifacts etc. on every page, and is quite different from modern books,in being willing to combine sources from archaeology, literature, history etc. etc. It dispels the idea that the Vikings were nothing but axe-wielding primitives. Anybody who can equal their craftsmanship or writing today is doing all right.

    Well, Coop, you can see you don't have to worry about a slightly off-topic posting. They enjoy it really! It is a very nice rifle, and if it is heavy to anyone more used to handling sporting rifles, that is exactly what a good target rifle ought to be.

    If it doesn't have a really crisp single-stage trigger, it could be worth fitting one, since there is no need to alter anything to fit one, and the original would always be replaceable. It looks like there might be two screwholes under that excellent rear sight, and if there are, you can fit a scope without drilling a rifle it would be a shame to alter.

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    'I know what war means. I have been with the armies of all the belligerents except one, and I have seen men die, and go mad, and lie in hospitals suffering hell; but there is a worse thing than that. War means an ugly mob madness, crucifying the truth tellers, choking the artists, sidetracking reforms, revolutions and the working of social forces'.

    John Reed


    tpatwil
    Starting Member



    USA
    1 Posts
    Posted - 01/07/2006 : 4:02:35 PM
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    I have a custom, heavy barrelled , bencrest rifle, built in the 1960's by Ted Holmes for my grandfather
    The all stainless steel barrell is about 1.5 inch dia, chamber in 6mm Holmes.
    Action is Shultz and Larson, also stainless, with a Unertal Vulture scope.
    I have a chipped extractor, and need to find a replacement or have someone fabricate a new one.

    Any ideas and help appreciated!

    Tim Williams

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    Last edited by kriggevaer; 09-21-2007 at 11:00 AM.
    kriggevr - skarpskytte, samler, jger
    "Roland was a warrior from the Land of the Midnight Sun..."

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