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  1. #46
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    The first page of a certified copy of the patent granted for SAKO for the invention of a "rifle sight" (i.e. the rear sight of m/28-30).


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    THe British BD blouse was not issued on a wide spread basis on the front due to its color being close to that of the enemy and iyt was avoided. Rear line and trousers yes but the brown wool was not a good choice for the front line troops.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vic View Post
    THe British BD blouse was not issued on a wide spread basis on the front due to its color being close to that of the enemy and iyt was avoided. Rear line and trousers yes but the brown wool was not a good choice for the front line troops.
    In addition to which much of the British-donated BD blouses & pants came in such a small sizes, that they got issued to Sotilaspojat (Soldier Boys) organisation, which was organisation for 15 - 18 year old boys who had volunteered to help Finnish military in non-combat capacity.

    Jarkko

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  5. #49
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    I found this nice photograph album from Sortavala Civil Guard District.




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    Finnish soldiers, Koskenlaskija cheese and a 1937 Pattern Mess Tin in June 1941. SA-Kuva 22538:




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    From what I understand the P37 mess tins were not uncommon during the opening phases of the Continuation war, much like the P37 battle dress trousers

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vic View Post
    THe British BD blouse was not issued on a wide spread basis on the front due to its color being close to that of the enemy and iyt was avoided. Rear line and trousers yes but the brown wool was not a good choice for the front line troops.
    Are you saying that they issued BD trousers with Finnish tunics for the front lines? Interesting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by skywarp View Post
    Any idea what aircraft that is?
    It's a Finnish-made VL Sääski IIA. It was operated by Ilmailukomppania ("Aviation Company") under the Helsinki Civil Guard District.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mangrove View Post
    It's a Finnish-made VL Sääski IIA. It was operated by Ilmailukomppania ("Aviation Company") under the Helsinki Civil Guard District.
    Thanks! What a pretty aircraft.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VL_S%C3%A4%C3%A4ski

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mangrove View Post
    It's a Finnish-made VL Sääski IIA. It was operated by Ilmailukomppania ("Aviation Company") under the Helsinki Civil Guard District.
    I really like this old ad from the company..
    Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #58
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    Semi-OT: One of the most interesting set of photos in site that Mangrove posted are the hundreds of photographs from C.G.E. Mannerheim's exploration through central Asia and China in 1906-1908. Link.
    Rautatieilmatorjuntakonekiväärikomppania

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denny View Post
    I really like this old ad from the company..
    Click image for larger version. 

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    That is cool! They must have also made the licensed Fokker D.21s?

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    Quote Originally Posted by skywarp View Post
    That is cool! They must have also made the licensed Fokker D.21s?
    Not sure but a link to a bunch of info..
    http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtop...2747&start=135


    Mangrove, hope its not to much of a detraction from your cool post, Denny

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    Quote Originally Posted by Denny View Post
    Not sure but a link to a bunch of info..
    http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtop...2747&start=135


    Mangrove, hope its not to much of a detraction from your cool post, Denny
    I've read that thread before... it's a little... funny.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skywarp View Post
    They must have also made the licensed Fokker D.21s?
    Here's a brochure made by the Valtion Lentokonetehdas (State Aircraft Factory) in 1938. It's in English. Apart from the Finnish types, they manufactured license-built Blackburn Ripons, de Havilland Moths, Gloster Gamecocks, Fokker C.X and D.XXIs and Bristol Blenheims at Tampere. They also made spare parts for them and also for e.g. Brewster F2A Buffalo.

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    The Civil Guard was a far cry from the Home Guard in the US during the War Between the States. It's really more akin to Volunteer Fire Departments in the US when you get down to it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mangrove View Post
    The Swedish Military forum guys would be interested in this pic. A Swedish M96 in use in Finland prior to the Winter War raises the question of how many were in the Civil Guard, and how they fared in competitive shooting. A "SA" stamped M96 sits in a rack alongside my M27, M28/30 and M39's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leon View Post
    The Swedish Military forum guys would be interested in this pic. A Swedish M96 in use in Finland prior to the Winter War raises the question of how many were in the Civil Guard, and how they fared in competitive shooting. A "SA" stamped M96 sits in a rack alongside my M27, M28/30 and M39's.
    According Palokangas there were about 1,360 Swedish m/96 rifles in Finnish Army inventory in year 1919. They got transferred to Civil Guard, which issued them mainly to Civil Guard districts of Finnish west coast, which were in large extent Swedish-speaking. As for how well these rifles faired in competitive shooting, its hard to say. Its known that Mosin-Nagants m/91 were unpopular for target shooting especially early on - not only due to limitations of the rifle design, but also because in early years only 7.62 x 54R ammunition commonly available to Civil Guard was captured Russian World War 1 era ammunition, which was apparently found to be large extent sub-standard quality. Hence early on rifles other than m/91, including various Mausers and Japanese rifles, were commonly favored for competitive shooting.

    Jarkko

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    Quote Originally Posted by JTV View Post
    According Palokangas there were about 1,360 Swedish m/96 rifles in Finnish Army inventory in year 1919. They got transferred to Civil Guard, which issued them mainly to Civil Guard districts of Finnish west coast, which were in large extent Swedish-speaking. As for how well these rifles faired in competitive shooting, its hard to say. Its known that Mosin-Nagants m/91 were unpopular for target shooting especially early on - not only due to limitations of the rifle design, but also because in early years only 7.62 x 54R ammunition commonly available to Civil Guard was captured Russian World War 1 era ammunition, which was apparently found to be large extent sub-standard quality. Hence early on rifles other than m/91, including various Mausers and Japanese rifles, were commonly favored for competitive shooting.

    Jarkko
    Thanks! I posted a link on the Swedish Military forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leon View Post
    The Swedish Military forum guys would be interested in this pic. A Swedish M96 in use in Finland prior to the Winter War raises the question of how many were in the Civil Guard, and how they fared in competitive shooting. A "SA" stamped M96 sits in a rack alongside my M27, M28/30 and M39's.
    Same here. I was overjoyed when I found mine.

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    Is there any information as to exactly how these m96 rifles came to be in Finnish service in 1919?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Minionki Rozrabiaja View Post
    Is there any information as to exactly how these m96 rifles came to be in Finnish service in 1919?
    I suggest posting this question on the Swedish Military forum, since there are Swedish members there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Minionki Rozrabiaja View Post
    Is there any information as to exactly how these m96 rifles came to be in Finnish service in 1919?
    Some came later than 1919. This one is dated 1922. I have another with a 1923 date.




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    Quote Originally Posted by JIMMY C View Post
    Some came later than 1919. This one is dated 1922. I have another with a 1923 date.
    SA-property marking makes that is one of about 50,000. Mine is from year 1923, but unlike yours did not see post World War 2 Swedish use. Check: http://www.jaegerplatoon.net/RIFLES6.htm#65KIV96

    Jarkko

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    Two things - first: some M96s were in Finland in the early 20s as JTV notes. I have no idea exactly how they arrived but the Civil Guard had in inventory for at least a short period. Later, after the Winter War started, many 10s of thousands came from Sweden. The SA mark doesn't say when they came but one would assume a 1922 came with the 1940s batch.

    Separately, nobody has ever posted a Civil Guard marked M96. You could be sure that was original from the early days. I think they must be REALLY rare. I have just purchased one and will show it when it arrives in the next couple weeks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparky236 View Post
    Separately, nobody has ever posted a Civil Guard marked M96. You could be sure that was original from the early days. I think they must be REALLY rare. I have just purchased one and will show it when it arrives in the next couple weeks.
    I look forward to seeing the rifle, as I have also searched for a CG marked Swedish M96 over the years and to date do not recall or remember ever seeing one.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pahtu View Post
    I look forward to seeing the rifle, as I have also searched for a CG marked Swedish M96 over the years and to date do not recall or remember ever seeing one.


    Pahtu.
    As a preview - it is marked in the wood like a CG T30 Arisaka.

    When I was in Finland in December, I saw two Winchester 95s that were also marked this way!

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparky236 View Post
    As a preview - it is marked in the wood like a CG T30 Arisaka.

    When I was in Finland in December, I saw two Winchester 95s that were also marked this way!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JVMK00 View Post
    And met some very nice members who were kind enough to show me their collection!

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparky236 View Post
    And met some very nice members who were kind enough to show me their collection!
    Way way back.....my memory tells me on an older version, a forgotten by me member, posted a M96 with the S stamp and number on the stock - Older GB version IIRC, have looked for one ever since. A Winchester 95 CG stamped....oh boy...how cool is that!

    Pahtu.

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    Two photographs out of a collection of 45,000 digitized photograph released by the Helsinki City Museum at www.helsinkiphotos.fi

    Now destroyed pavilion at Malmi shooting range in 1990, location of the World's Championship Shootings of 1937.



    Honour guard at Helsinki Market Square in 1920.


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    Neat post, but no way is that 1920 with M28's or 28-30s in the photo.
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    Those are conscripts with m/27 rifles and m/27 tunics.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CH View Post
    Those are conscripts with m/27 rifles and m/27 tunics.
    And M27 rifles. I forgot one. The absolute earliest this could be is 1928 then.
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