"New" Dragoon. Question on stock markings.
Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: "New" Dragoon. Question on stock markings.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW PA
    Posts
    1,397

    Default "New" Dragoon. Question on stock markings.

    Just received this 1905 Dragoon. Finn marked. Looks like there are no import marks. The stock is confusing me a little. There are two cartouches. One looks to have a PCCP stamp. The other looks to be an inspector mark. I've read a little about the stampings, but don't have knowlege of the time period of the markings. Regardless, the stamps would be post WW1. What confuses me is the "W" stamp on the butt and the "V" stamp on the underside of the stock. I thought those were Austrian or German stamps.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20170421_124840.jpg  

    20170421_124859.jpg  

    20170421_124904.jpg  

    20170421_124909.jpg  

    Mosin Fanboy

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW PA
    Posts
    1,397

    Default

    Sorry, the photos must have been over the size limit. I'll have to add them in separate posts.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20170421_124915.jpg  

    20170421_124920.jpg  

    20170421_125016.jpg  

    20170421_125034.jpg  

    Mosin Fanboy

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW PA
    Posts
    1,397

    Default

    More photos. This one shows the stock cartouche, inspector mark, and the "W" or "M".
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20170421_125059.jpg  

    20170421_125138.jpg  

    20170421_125208.jpg  

    20170421_125234.jpg  

    Mosin Fanboy

  4. Remove Advertisements
    GunBoards.com
    Advertisements
     

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW PA
    Posts
    1,397

    Default

    Last photos. This shows the "V".
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20170421_125314.jpg  

    20170421_125410.jpg  

    Mosin Fanboy

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Central Finland
    Posts
    4,006

    Default

    I don't have the Rifle 91 Renovation Instructions at hand right now but IIRC when an armorer did some repairs, like drilled extra hole for the cleaning rod nut, he completed the work by stamping the first letter of his surname. I must admit though that I don't know German or Austrian modifications at all but that's something that Finns did, at least according to the regulation, published in 1927.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW PA
    Posts
    1,397

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CH View Post
    I don't have the Rifle 91 Renovation Instructions at hand right now but IIRC when an armorer did some repairs, like drilled extra hole for the cleaning rod nut, he completed the work by stamping the first letter of his surname. I must admit though that I don't know German or Austrian modifications at all but that's something that Finns did, at least according to the regulation, published in 1927.
    Thanks. Finnish armored initials would make sense since the stock is post WW1.

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
    Mosin Fanboy

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Outer Mongolia
    Posts
    8,765

    Default

    Hello Willy,

    While it's typically applied on the top of the comb just ahead of the butt-plate tang, inspectors get lazy sometimes or are in a hurry. The W is indeed an indication that your stock was inspected at an Austro-Hungarian depot during WWI. Having passed through Finland, it's hard to know exactly when this barreled receiver was mated to this stock?

    The scrubbed serial number on the butt-plate doesn't match the receiver number, so chances are the rifle was rebuilt sometime after 1905. With no apparent Austro-Hungarian markings on the barrel or receiver, it's not likely that it was rebuilt during WWI.

    I haven't a clue regarding the markings in front of the magazine tang. My best guess is that it's a Finn rebuild since there are some Soviet markings present.

    Still, it's nice clean Dragoon. Nice find!

    Warmest regards,

    JPS

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Outer Mongolia
    Posts
    8,765

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by willyj73 View Post
    Thanks. Finnish armored initials would make sense since the stock is post WW1.

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

    With an Austro-Hungarian depot mark? I think not.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW PA
    Posts
    1,397

    Default

    Aren't these Soviet markings?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Soviet markings.jpg  

    Mosin Fanboy

  11. #10
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    1,779

    Default

    Boy that's a nice Dragoon. I'm still trying to find one myself. Congrats

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Location
    Outer Mongolia
    Posts
    8,765

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by willyj73 View Post
    Aren't these Soviet markings?

    Hard to say as faint as they are? As crisp as the "W" markings have remained, that could esily be the original Imperial rondel. As for the inspectors mark, most of the rifles that survived WWI, the Revolution and the Civil War were eventually arsenal refurbished.

    Nice rifle!

    JPS

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    2,896

    Default

    Great looking Dragoon willyj73 congrats......and an Imperial Finn Capture at that!. I have a "W" or "M" stamp on my Finn capture Dragoon behind the rear sight. I asked the Forum years ago about it and I forget what the consensus on it was. Some sort of inspection stamp.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	DSC00016.jpg 
Views:	9 
Size:	292.5 KB 
ID:	2166890

    The same rifle has a cool stock stamp to keep an eye out for. The were usually lightly struck, were often sanded or worn away, and are easy to overlook. Denny

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	10.jpg 
Views:	16 
Size:	190.9 KB 
ID:	2166898

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    York,Pa
    Posts
    1,049

    Default

    I tent to agree the stock is a soviet stock. Large cartouche with the smaller one beside it. Can't say I've ever seen a imperial dragoon stock with the smaller cartouche also?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •