(with pictures now): VALUE quesiton, please. 1943 Tula PU sniper/1943 YO Pu scope.
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Thread: (with pictures now): VALUE quesiton, please. 1943 Tula PU sniper/1943 YO Pu scope.

  1. #1
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    Question (with pictures now): VALUE quesiton, please. 1943 Tula PU sniper/1943 YO Pu scope.

    1943 Tula (not Izhevsk, as originally posted, thank you) PU sniper. great condition. Molot import (MO serial on the side).
    What is the current going rate for it, please? Thank you.

    Higher res images: https://goo.gl/photos/cvWUyu1RVRCdCSsK6
    Last edited by KAIFS; 06-15-2017 at 09:48 PM.







  2. #2
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    I would think $700 to $1000.Depending on were you are and if your buying it on auction

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    Default VALUE quesiton, please. 1943 izzy PU sniper - Molot Import.

    The price will greatly depend on visual condition, stock color and repairs wether or not original matching and if it has original scope numbers and if it's matching to the scope. Regular refurb with some restamped parts $750-950, $550-650 if u get lucky and watch proxibid daily. All original parts (non force matched) with beautiful dark cherry stock with no repairs 850-1000. Same thing with original scope numbers in tact and matching scope add another $500-$700. 100% matching with original blue... well, never seen this one for sale but would assume $2000 at the very least. However there's a saying in Russia that translates as "without fools life would be bad" so that being said i've seen regular refurbs with every single parts restamped to match being sold for $1800


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    Default VALUE quesiton, please. 1943 izzy PU sniper - Molot Import.

    The make of pu scope will also come into play somewhat if it's something uncommon like yoshkar ola or Kharkov or the ones with square aluminum bodies


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    Quote Originally Posted by pavlin View Post
    The price will greatly depend on visual condition, stock color and repairs wether or not original matching and if it has original scope numbers and if it's matching to the scope. Regular refurb with some restamped parts $750-950, $550-650 if u get lucky and watch proxibid daily. All original parts (non force matched) with beautiful dark cherry stock with no repairs 850-1000. Same thing with original scope numbers in tact and matching scope add another $500-$700. 100% matching with original blue... well, never seen this one for sale but would assume $2000 at the very least. However there's a saying in Russia that translates as "without fools life would be bad" so that being said i've seen regular refurbs with every single parts restamped to match being sold for $1800


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I have three (two Tulas and an Ihevsk) from the Molot batch that are completely original matching, though all three unfortunately had a coat of shellac applied. It would take a lot to separate me from any of them.







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    here are some images of it, anything special should be captured in addition? Thank you.
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    I gather 1943 Yoshkar-Ola scope, so same year as the rifle. Optics are clear and sharp.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_5932.jpg  

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    Last edited by KAIFS; 06-15-2017 at 09:11 PM.







  8. #7
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    Interesting. It appears that the rifle itself may be original matching. It has its original stamped floorplate, and bolt and buttplate also appear to be original matching. Wouldn't be surprised if that's the original stock as well (it's definitely a Tula), though it's been heavily shellacked during refurb. Scope mount and scope have been replaced, probably at refurb.

    So far so good, but now comes the bad part: there's something weird going on with the front scope base screw (seen inside receiver). Can you get closer pics of that (and if possible, also from the outside with the scope and mount removed from the base)?







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    Oh by the way, it's not​ an Izhevsk.







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    Well, I thought Bubba had been at that front screw for some reason. It is a bit unusual looking (silver color inside receiver and looks slightly larger diameter, though that part may be optical illusion). Looks normal outside the base, though.

    I personally would consider that a way above average PU, assuming the bore is good and everything is functionally sound. The rifle being a Tula already adds value, plus it's pretty unusual to find one (especially a Tula) with that many original parts.







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    Quote Originally Posted by Ol' Relic View Post
    Well, I thought Bubba had been at that front screw for some reason. It is a bit unusual looking (silver color inside receiver and looks slightly larger diameter, though that part may be optical illusion). Looks normal outside the base, though.

    I personally would consider that a way above average PU, assuming the bore is good and everything is functionally sound. The rifle being a Tula already adds value, plus it's pretty unusual to find one (especially a Tula) with that many original parts.
    forward screw on the base is indeed larger in diameter (compared to tang one) and is for sure as it came. it is silver colored inside of the receiver, so neither is an optical illusion.
    So larger screw is not something that is found/seen?

    I am a Swedish mauser guy, not a Mosin expert... My speculation is: during referb they must of stripped that screw and replaced it (re-tapped it as well, obviously) with a larger diameter screw. as diameter on the inside is larger as well. Possible?







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    Quote Originally Posted by KAIFS View Post
    forward screw on the base is indeed larger in diameter (compared to tang one) and is for sure as it came. it is silver colored inside of the receiver, so neither is an optical illusion.
    So larger screw is not something that is found/seen?
    I have never seen one like that before. I'm leaning toward thinking it's something they did at the arsenal, though, as the screw and its keeper screw look normal on the outside of the base.

    Two possibilities, basically: a. the arsenal had oversized repair screws, one of which they used on a damaged hole in this case, or b. someone repaired a stripped base screw post import and did a surprisingly good job matching the appearance of an original screw head on the outside of the base.

    I don't think that screw would stop me if I were looking to buy this PU, but of course that's just my opinion.







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    That is just weird. No CN evident on the barrel, stamped numbers on barrel matching EP'd numbers on scope mount. Tula is not normally seen with numbers but since is a Molot I just don't know, just CN if I recall correctly. Izhevsk would have the numbers on the barrel. Post war sling slot fillers. Very unusual.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dallased View Post
    That is just weird. No CN evident on the barrel, stamped numbers on barrel matching EP'd numbers on scope mount. Tula is not normally seen with numbers but since is a Molot I just don't know, just CN if I recall correctly. Izhevsk would have the numbers on the barrel. Post war sling slot fillers. Very unusual.
    from what I understood, slot escutcheons Late/Post War are considered 1943 and later. CH mark - well, its strong C and part of a H.
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    notice CH mark on these 1943 samples, its almost as H often NOT fully stamped?
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...iper-Pic-Heavy
    http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/ot...pictorial.html







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    This is a original Tula PU sniper. The light strike CH is not uncommon.

    I agree with most of what O'Relic said. I would buy this and would pay more then the average PU price.

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    thank you all for the info, I was actually considered selling it locally and was trying to get a handle on the price. Prices are all over the place with this http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...57bb1b547a678e selling out within two hours of being posted, so I did not want to short myself. Not exactly in a hurry to sell either , not like these dipping in prices lately. I got it hand picked from AIM the first day these came on and they had a few of these 1943 Tula's at a slightly higher premium (+ hand pick fee) back in the day.
    I shot it at 100 and 300m and it did great (well, better with my handloads vs. 7n1 and/or Match Extra) - but it ain't same shooting or joy as my swede m/41 and m/41b snipers. Got a type m/28 (without permanent modification and still have original) 'two stage' trigger installed, improvement for sure. So one of the local collectors expressed interest to buy it and I am considering, just did not know what to ask/negotiate/counter with, as far as a number.







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    Quote Originally Posted by msniper19 View Post
    This is a original Tula PU sniper. The light strike CH is not uncommon.

    I agree with most of what O'Relic said. I would buy this and would pay more then the average PU price.
    One thing that is for certain is that it is not in original condition. Izhevsk refurb replacement parts are clearly visible. So is the sanding and refinishing. The repair to the receive threaded hole is interesting. Never seen larger bolts/pin used and silver soldered

  20. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by KAIFS View Post
    thank you all for the info, I was actually considered selling it locally and was trying to get a handle on the price. Prices are all over the place with this http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...57bb1b547a678e selling out within two hours of being posted, so I did not want to short myself. Not exactly in a hurry to sell either , not like these dipping in prices lately. I got it hand picked from AIM the first day these came on and they had a few of these 1943 Tula's at a slightly higher premium (+ hand pick fee) back in the day.
    I shot it at 100 and 300m and it did great (well, better with my handloads vs. 7n1 and/or Match Extra) - but it ain't same shooting or joy as my swede m/41 and m/41b snipers. Got a type m/28 (without permanent modification and still have original) 'two stage' trigger installed, improvement for sure. So one of the local collectors expressed interest to buy it and I am considering, just did not know what to ask/negotiate/counter with, as far as a number.
    Keep in mind that places like Simpson LtD, Liberty Tree, Mr Eisel, etc has large following of buyers that apparently don't mind paying heavy premiums over average market. So it's rather hard for us mere mortals to get the same valuations when it comes to selling.
    Last edited by eyesis; 06-16-2017 at 06:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eyesis View Post
    One thing that is for certain is that it is not in original condition. Izhevsk refurb replacement parts are clearly visible. So is the sanding and refinishing. The repair to the receive threaded hole is interesting. Never seen larger bolts/pin used and silver soldered
    Nobody said it was in original condition. The cocking piece is obviously from a midwar Izhevsk, and the Izhevsk scope mount and Yoshkar-Ola scope are replacements.

    That being said, it still has a very unusually high number of original parts, and is streets ahead of all the normal scrubbed/reblued/restamped PUs on the market.

    And anyway, if one is looking for a PU in 100% original condition, I fear the wait will be a long one.







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    Quote Originally Posted by msniper19 View Post
    This is a original Tula PU sniper. The light strike CH is not uncommon.

    I agree with most of what O'Relic said. I would buy this and would pay more then the average PU price.
    +1 Nice piece.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ol' Relic View Post
    Nobody said it was in original condition. The cocking piece is obviously from a midwar Izhevsk, and the Izhevsk scope mount and Yoshkar-Ola scope are replacements.

    That being said, it still has a very unusually high number of original parts, and is streets ahead of all the normal scrubbed/reblued/restamped PUs on the market.

    And anyway, if one is looking for a PU in 100% original condition, I fear the wait will be a long one.
    Previous poster stated is original Tula sniper. It is not. It is geniune Tula sniper that has been refurbished.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eyesis View Post
    Previous poster stated is original Tula sniper. It is not. It is geniune Tula sniper that has been refurbished.
    Yes it is refurbished. That doesn't change the fact that it is a original Tula sniper as opposed to a fake Tula sniper now does it? I didn't use the words, 100% factory original.

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    Looks like a pretty nice refurbed example. The Molot imports got a scope serial number on the barrel shank at refurb , even on Tulas, so that is normal. About $1000+/- is a place to start in a friend sale IMO.
    Last edited by mike radford; 06-18-2017 at 01:56 AM.

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    I'm curious to know what is stamped on the tang for a date. The 43 in the date appears to be stamped later and doesn't match the 19 in the date on the barrel. If you enlarge the photo of the barrel it's very easy to see the 43 is in a different font. Also the barrel appears to have the Izhevsk sniper mark circle over C. My 42 Tula PU has both the CH and the Izhevsk circle C as well. Hopefully Ratnik will take a look at these pictures and give his opinion.

    Eric
    Looking for PU scope number 10062. See post http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...light=pashutr3

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    After taking another look at the date it appears as though the original 43 is underneath and someone just re-engraved it. Still would like to know the tang date though. Prices are starting to rise overall on legit PU snipers. Good legit Tula PUs don't come up for sale too often. It's smart to check on a piece if your not sure how to spot fakes and rescoped ex snipers.
    Looking for PU scope number 10062. See post http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...light=pashutr3

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    i think you were correct the first time
    look at the extra black paint.
    look at the dia of the screw and its screw head.
    i think a refurb repair with the next larger screw thread.
    (repairing a stripped hole)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ol' Relic View Post
    Well, I thought Bubba had been at that front screw for some reason. It is a bit unusual looking (silver color inside receiver and looks slightly larger diameter, though that part may be optical illusion). Looks normal outside the base, though.

    I personally would consider that a way above average PU, assuming the bore is good and everything is functionally sound. The rifle being a Tula already adds value, plus it's pretty unusual to find one (especially a Tula) with that many original parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PAshutr3 View Post
    I'm curious to know what is stamped on the tang for a date. The 43 in the date appears to be stamped later and doesn't match the 19 in the date on the barrel. If you enlarge the photo of the barrel it's very easy to see the 43 is in a different font. Also the barrel appears to have the Izhevsk sniper mark circle over C. My 42 Tula PU has both the CH and the Izhevsk circle C as well. Hopefully Ratnik will take a look at these pictures and give his opinion.

    Eric
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    I installed the 'm28 two stage' trigger - still have original one







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    Very cool sniper; Izhevsk receiver and barrel finished at Tula it appears. I think Ratnik would be very interested in seeing these pictures. Can you make out the date stamped on the tang? I just bought a 44 Tula PU that appears to have a partial Izhevsk circle C proof on the barrel as well.

    Eric
    Looking for PU scope number 10062. See post http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...light=pashutr3

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    Quote Originally Posted by PAshutr3 View Post
    Very cool sniper; Izhevsk receiver and barrel finished at Tula it appears. I think Ratnik would be very interested in seeing these pictures. Can you make out the date stamped on the tang? I just bought a 44 Tula PU that appears to have a partial Izhevsk circle C proof on the barrel as well.

    Eric
    That's the norm for '43 and '44 Tulas. Sometimes the receiver is Izhevsk "branded", sometimes not.







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    I have seen recycled receivers quite often in 1944 Tula M44 production as well as 1943 91/30 production over the years. I guess I just never noticed a prevalence of recycled parts or Izhevsk receiver/barrels in Tula sniper production. I will have to pull the action out of the stock and check my new 44 Tula PU tomorrow after work.

    I learn new stuff here every day!

    Thanks,
    PA
    Looking for PU scope number 10062. See post http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...light=pashutr3

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    Interesting rifle, I like the stock and boy that bore looks great. Should be a great shooter!

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    Quote Originally Posted by PAshutr3 View Post
    I have seen recycled receivers quite often in 1944 Tula M44 production as well as 1943 91/30 production over the years. I guess I just never noticed a prevalence of recycled parts or Izhevsk receiver/barrels in Tula sniper production. I will have to pull the action out of the stock and check my new 44 Tula PU tomorrow after work.

    I learn new stuff here every day!

    Thanks,
    PA
    Some "recycled" receivers were used. However, the main theme is that Izhevsk was essentially the supplier of receiver and barrel blanks for Tula's production needs. IIRC, it's covered in Ratnik's book. Also, some interesting discussion about the subject in this thread:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...+barrel+blanks







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    Thanks for the link; interesting read, I missed that discussion some how.

    Eric
    Looking for PU scope number 10062. See post http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...light=pashutr3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ol' Relic View Post
    Some "recycled" receivers were used. However, the main theme is that Izhevsk was essentially the supplier of receiver and barrel blanks for Tula's production needs. IIRC, it's covered in Ratnik's book. Also, some interesting discussion about the subject in this thread:
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...+barrel+blanks
    That is a five star thread!!!

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    +1 on the lack of clear sniper mark. There is sort of a "C" maybe.

    My 43 Tula MOLOT sniper has no big billboard like that one but also has scope number on side of rifle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dallased View Post
    That is just weird. No CN evident on the barrel, stamped numbers on barrel matching EP'd numbers on scope mount. Tula is not normally seen with numbers but since is a Molot I just don't know, just CN if I recall correctly. Izhevsk would have the numbers on the barrel. Post war sling slot fillers. Very unusual.

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