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  1. #1
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    Default national match .30/06 ammo

    My buddys dad recently gave me an unopened box of 1965 lake city match ammo. he says he has cases of this stuff that he got from a guy who worked as an armorer back in the 70's. Is there any value to this stuff? he also mentioned having unopened bandoliers of garand ammo, and some more in unopened spam cans. thanks ! Chad

  2. #2
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    Dec 2007
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    Default

    LC national match marked and packaged ammo is now more or less in the realm of collector status as is any surviving bandoleers or sealed cases of military issue Garand ammo made by a U.S. arsenal or commercial contractor. Collectors buy it to enhance their U.S. collections. It has been a while since I have seen a box of Lake City as until recently I had not been to a real gun show in years but i would say minimum of 25.00 a box and maybe as much as 40.00 to 50.00 depending on whose looking.
    Some people still shoot the stuff (ouch!!!!)as I found some spent marked casings left at the range but it might have been reloads at the end of the casings service life.

  3. #3
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    I'd say that NM .30-06 and original bandoliered stuff could go either way as to collectability. A friend of mine has a bunch of NM '06 that he still shoots and since all of us are Garand and Springfield shooters, bandoliered ammo is still pretty common to us. If someone has full, unopened cases of this ammo, then by virtue of the sheer quantity of it available, it's collectability goes down. 90% of people would say shoot it, 10% would say collector value. The trick is finding a collector who does not have what you have already...Having been an ammo collector and shooter for well over 20 years, you can sit on something for years before you find a buyer. You can also have ammo that is rare and valuable, then some years later, someone finds a whole warehouse of the stuff and it's value goes down to shooter grade ammo!

    D.D.

  4. #4
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    Default LC Match

    http://wardogmilitaria.com/index.php...roducts_id=720

    Currently the 1962 vintage is available here for less than $16 per box.

    80 Rounds of 1968 sold on Gunbroker yesterday for $25 per box. I bought a ten loose boxes of '68 and 1 box of '62 for less than $10 per box last August.

    I bought mine to shoot through my Garand. If you want to market it on the Trader there will be many potential buyers, but you're likely to get more for it from an auction.

    It may not be collectible to most ... yet.

  5. #5

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    I still have a bit that I bought when the CMP was selling it. I shoot it.

  6. #6
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    Default 1963 match ammo

    I have `18 boxes of this ammo Lake City 173 gr 3006 vintage 1963.Anybody here have an idea what it is worth.I am trading it as partial payment on a pistol and I want to get fair price.Thanks.

    Darr

  7. #7
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    Default national match .30/06 ammo

    $20 a box. Thats what they sell for at the shows. Even that is expensive but if you figure what a normal box of match grade goes for, it's not that bad. Its still around, and people pull it out of the back of the closets every once in awhile, wipe off the dust, and shoot it. I do. wolf

  8. #8
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    Dec 1969
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    Default

    $15-20 per box.

    There is still tons of M72 match floating around. Seems people rat holed it more than they shot it ! I have 5-6 cases of it weighing down my basement myself.....

    I wouldn't say LC 1965 is a " rare " year. Real early lots of FA T275/XM72/M72 and LC T275/M72 bring a collectors premium because it is much harder to find nice condition boxes and they made alot less of it compared to what was made 1964-69 so most actually got shot up..

  9. #9
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    Dec 1969
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    Default

    The ODCMP doesn't sell it online anymore but they still have it at the Anniston and Ohio stores. The Match will bring some money if you sell it on gunbroker etc. Mark it "rare" and watch the newbie bids come in.
    How many psi in a CUP?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
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    Default

    I have five 20 round boxes of 1965 Lake City Match ammo (7.62 mm Match XM 118 lot LC 12043 173 grains). Three of the five cardboard paper boxes are very nice. The last two the tops were opened. All told I have about 220 rounds on LC Match, although the rest are in Flambeau cartridge boxes. Are these rounds collectible?

  11. #11
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  12. #12
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lite-box View Post
    . . .Real early lots of FA T275/XM72/M72 and LC T275/M72 bring a collectors premium . . .
    I wouldn't spend a lot of time looking for some of these because they don't exist. T275 was the 7.62MM International Match made only by FA. There never was a Cal .30 T275. There is no such thing as XM72 or LC T275.

    Both Cal .30 and 7.62MM Match are for sale quite often on places such as Gun Broker. It can be found priced anywhere from $10 to $50 per box but is worth about $25 for a clean sealed box. The price will go up once it is all shot up but who can say when that will be?

    Ray

  13. #13
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    Are we talking ammo or wine? Both age and can become collector items, but both can turn to vinegar. I have 1918 RA 30-06 ammo in M1 clips that ate right through the casings. Lucky, they were a gift, unlucky, they would have nice presentation pieces.

    To the original OP - I would sell individual boxes to collectors and forget about high price sales of cases/tins. Millions exist today, so they are not worth a fortune, but many folks will appreciate them if they can afford them.

    Enough said.
    Seen on U.S. Forces bumper sticker:
    Its Gods job to judge the terrorists, its our mission to arrange the meeting.

  14. #14
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    Default We should distinguish...

    between 'Match' and 'National Match' ammunition. The true NM ammo was made in specific lots for issue at the national matches: the ammo is headstamped 'NM', with the usual manufacturer's initials and two-digit date - e.g.: 'LC 67 NM', and the boxes were marked as National Match ammunition, while 'Match' ammunition was made in much larger quantities for marksmanship training and competition, and was used for sniping. The match ammo is headstamped as: 'LC 67 Match', etc., and the boxes marked as such. The match ammunition was always excellent stuff, but the NM was always made and selected as the best possible at the time. Much more of the standard match ammo has survived, while remaining examples of the NM ammo are considerably less common, and should be considered more desireable for collectors.
    PRD1 - mhb - Mike

  15. #15
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    PRD

    What you say is more or less true. Each year, one lot of Match ammunition was designated for shipment directly to Camp Perry to be used in the NT and EIT matches. The cases were specially headstamped and the boxes marked differently in only 9 of the 78 years that match ammunition was manufactured by Frankford and Lake City. Those cartridges and boxes sometimes will bring a premium, but not always. There are still thousands of them available on the various auction sites. I have paid as little as $20 for a clean, sealed box.

    The other lots of match ammunition were issued for practice, local and regional matches, but could also be used in the NT and EIT matches. To a collector, like me, the lots designated for Camp Perry but not specially marked are just as valuable as those that are. You just have to know which lot numbers to look for.

    All National Match ammunition was manufactured to the same specifications. The "Camp Perry" lots were sometimes more accurate than the other lots, and sometimes they weren't. But, all of it was more or less equally good and shooters could not really tell the difference.

    All of this became moot in the early 1990s when shooters were allowed to use handloads or commercial ammunition if they so chose. Most of them did just that.

    Ray

  16. #16
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    Default Ray:

    I don't have a really good reference on the cal. .30 match ammo types, but have been 'accumulating' and shooting the stuff for something like 45 years.
    So far as the statement that only 9 years out of the 78 years' production of NM ammo were specifically headstamped and boxes marked to identify it as NM - I'm confused... I have sample rounds of pre-war NM headstamped ammo going back to 1929 (and some earlier stuff, including a clip of 1921NM - 'Tin Can' - which is not marked as NM, but which definitely was used for that purpose) and including 1938, 1939, and, I think, 1940 - I don't have every year in that range, and am aware that there was at least one year in which no NM ammo was produced (1931?), but have enough examples (and photos of NM-marked boxes going back to at least 1925) to believe that there were more than 9 lots in the period from 1925, say, to 1940 (the last pre-war lot) which were NM headstamped and/or issued in NM packaging. Additionally, FA produced and packaged International and Palma match ammunition (I don't have any samples, so don't know what the HS's were) in that time frame. As far as I know, there was no such thing as 'Match' ammunition (i.e.: no equivalent of M72), per-se, before production of special ammunition for competition and marksmanship activities resumed in the mid-50's
    From post-war production, I have or have seen NM headstamped ammo of both FA and LC production covering the years (IIRC) 1958 through 1968. So, counting pre-and-post war production, there must have been more than 9 lots of NM headstamped .30 ammunition, I believe.
    If you have a reference which provides lot number identification of NM lots which were not NM headstamped, I'd sure like to have a copy because I've got a fairly large quantity of M72 of 1960's production which is headstamped 'Match', and the boxes marked as such.

    I don't think I can agree that match shooters in the 60's could not tell the difference between the best NM ammo and only average lots: NM scores from year-to-year and shooters' comments (and I began HP competition in the early 60's) made it clear (at least to me) that some lots were better than others. The Rifleman magazine used to report on the average accuracy (from acceptance testing) of each year's NM ammo, also, and it was obvious that there was some variation, though the average was quite good.
    At the same time, competitors (including yours truly) who had the option used handloaded ammunition with better bullets (or pulled the M72 and seated Sierra match bullets - 'Mexican Match' - with notable improvements in average scores. We did the same with M118 match through the 80's, until LC took the hint and coughed-up the M852, which turned our issued M14 NM rifles from 10-ring to X-ring guns.

    PRD1 - mhb - Mike

  17. #17
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    Mike

    I collect the National Match ammunition and did quite a bit of research on it which resulted in an article I wrote for the IAA JOURNAL just recently. It was re-printed on German Salazar's site. Here's a link to it. After you have read it I would really like to discuss it further, maybe best off the Forum. please contact me by email at joyray(at)frontiernet(dot)net

    http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com...mmunition.html

    Ray

  18. #18
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    Default Ray:

    Thanks for the link! That is an interesting and informative article. It causes me to ask a question: the FA 35 NM round illustrated has a nickle-plated primer (Monel?) apparently, while my examples (two fired rounds on my bench, here, and a sealed box on clips), have standard brass primers - can you clarify?
    I'll contact you via e-mail.
    PRD - mhb - Mike

  19. #19
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PRD1 View Post
    Additionally, FA produced and packaged International and Palma match ammunition (I don't have any samples, so don't know what the HS's were) in that time frame.
    Remington's headstamps were REM-UMC 30-200-06
    http://forums.gunboards.com/showthre...ighlight=Palma

  20. #20
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    The REM-UMC 30-200-06 headstamp was used only for the 1924 Olympics. The cartridges and box shown in the link may or may not be either. The photos are too blurry to tell. Also, the 1924 cartridges were loaded with a special 200 grain Cupro-Nickel bullet which the ones in the photo do not appear to have. Remington (and Winchester) used several different headstamps on their Palma and International ammunition over the years.

    Frankford Arsenal also used a variety of headstamps to identify their Palma Match and International Match loads.

    Ray

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
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    Default

    LC M72 is by no means rare, you can still get it through the military ammo supply system they have that much of it still in storage. The AF/ANG still gets it for thier 30 cal AFPG Garands.

    Value roughly 1.5 - 2X current M2 Ball prices. If you sell it by the box ( rarer earlier years will bring premium esp to a box collector ) you will get the most $ but anyone buying by the Can/Wood case is going to want a good bulk discount. Bandoleer/ Enbloc packed cans wil bring a bit less.

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