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  1. #1
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    Aug 2008
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    Default Is this Westernfield a Mossberg or a Stevens?

    I have an old (early 1930s) Wards Western Field (aka Westernfield) Model 36 .22 bolt action. The cross-references show that Wards sold both the Mossberg 10 and the Stevens 52B (or 52B-62-83N) under this name.

    Does anyone know how I can determine whether my Model 36 is actually a Mossberg or a Stevens? In the few photos I have found, both look like the Model 36.

    Beyond just wanting to know its origin, I'd like to improve my odds of finding the right parts if at some point something needs to be replaced.

    BTW, many cross-references list this Wards .22 as a Mossberg 10 or a Stevens/Savage (same company) 521, but as the 521 is a shotgun it is clear that they are simply repeating the same error. The Stevens 52B is a .22 bolt action of the correct vintage.

    Bill

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
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    Southwest Side of the Metromess, Texas
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    226

    Default

    Post some pictures and we can go from there.....
    You may all go to Hell, and I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett...1835


    NMCA Member #1966

    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in Overalls and Looks like Work.... Thomas Edison (1847 - 1931)

  3. #3
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    Aug 2008
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    Portland, Oregon
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    Default

    The only marks on the rifle that I have found are:

    Wards Western Field
    MODEL 36 CAL 22 S. L. OR L.R.

    and a "14" inside a circle where the barrel meets the receiver. I have seen no words, symbols, or other marks anywhere else on the rifle. The two sling swivels on this rifle are aftermarket (Uncle Mike), so are of no value in identifying the maker.

    One notable item is that a small brass rectangle has been inserted into the steel at the rear of the front sight, which may be the "'gold' bead flat top front sight" referred to in the description of the Mossberg 10. Unfortunately, the Stevens 52B photographed is missing its front sight, and may have had something similar.

    Here are photos of the rifle:







    A photo of a Stevens 52B with a missing front sight:



    And images of a Mossberg 10:









    As can be seen, the Mossberg 10 and the Stevens 52B look very similar, and both look like my Western Field 36.

    Bill


    Quote Originally Posted by Solddaboat View Post
    Post some pictures and we can go from there.....
    Last edited by Gun_Shy; 02-12-2009 at 04:33 AM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    100

    Default Is this Westernfield a Mossberg or a Stevens?

    If you look at the length of forearm in front of the gripping groove, I think yours is a Stevens. That's my opinion which is worth exactly what you paid for it.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
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    Southwest Side of the Metromess, Texas
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    226

    Default

    Well for starters... I think it is probably a Mossberg model 25/25A or maybe a 20-21-24...
    I have a model 10 and the biggest differences I can see from your pictures are (1) the base of the bolt handle where it is attached to the bolt is rectangular where mine is round (2) on my model 10 the stock is 23 1/2" and the finger groove on the forearm is narrower and ends only 1 1/2" from the front of the stock, where yours looks at least 3 1/2" or more. The barrel on a model 10 is 22" bet you a dollar to a donut your's is 24".... Will try to post a picture of my model 10 tomorrow.. The more I look at the models on damguy's site the more I think it is a model 20 or 21.... Anyone out there have one of them????
    Last edited by Solddaboat; 02-12-2009 at 11:29 PM.
    You may all go to Hell, and I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett...1835


    NMCA Member #1966

    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in Overalls and Looks like Work.... Thomas Edison (1847 - 1931)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
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    Default

    That's a good point. On the other hand, the groove on the pictured Stevens 52B ends fore of the breech, while on mine it ends at the back of the breech.

    The furniture on this is not of the highest quality workmanship. The barrel and receiver are not centered (laterally) in the stock. Given the low cost of these (whether Mossbeg, Stevens, or Western Field), I expect there is considerable range of variation in the stocks.

    Too, I don't trust that the Mossberg drawing is accurate to scale, but did notice that the stock in it looks much shorter than mine. On the other hand, the dimensions of mine match or are close to those given in the description of the Mossberg 10. Unfortunately, I don't have the same sort of description of the Stevens.

    Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by dbldblu View Post
    If you look at the length of forearm in front of the gripping groove, I think yours is a Stevens. That's my opinion which is worth exactly what you paid for it.

  7. #7
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    Aug 2008
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
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    Default

    The points about the stock length and bolt handle are good; these may be the most important points. What is the overall length of your rifle? Does your bolt look like this one (mine does not -- it has a pin through the bolt below the bolt handle, for example, and the handle is canted towards the rear (long side) a bit)?




    On the other hand, you'd lose your bet on the barrel length:

    Western Field 36:
    barrel: 21" (actually, 20 15/16") to front of receiver
    barrel: 22" overall (ie, including the part inside the receiver)
    takedown length, with bolt: 27"
    takedown length, without bolt: 26 1/4"
    stock length, diagonal, front of stock to bottom of butt: 27"
    stock length, linear*: 27 1/4"
    overall length, diagonal, barrel tip to bottom of butt: 39 7/8"
    overall length, linear: 40"

    (*By "linear" I mean measuring straight back along the rifle to the furthest point, as if the butt were square rather than curved.)

    The finger groove ends 3" from the front of the stock on the left side and 3 1/4" from the front on the right side.

    The Mossberg 10 description gives dimensions of 22" barrel, 27" takedown length, and 40" overall length, so these match. But Numrich also lists the Stevens barrel at 22", and if both the Stevens and Mossberg were sold as the Model 36, then they are very similar rifles.

    While the Western Field Model 36 was actually a Mossberg 10 or a Stevens/Savage 52B, according to the usual cross-references a Western Field Model 36B was actually a Mossberg 10 or a Mossberg 25A. If you check Numrich (www.e-gunparts.com) for major parts, the same parts are used on the Western Field 36 and 36B, and on the Mossberg 10 and 25A, and Numrich uses the same part numbers for the Western Field parts and the Mossberg parts, except adding an "A" after the Mossberg numbers and a "B" after the Western Field numbers. It appears there was a high degree of parts interchangability between the Western Field 36 & 36B and the Mossberg 10 and 25A. Of course, Numrich could be wrong in its parts identification.

    And there it is, in the Numrich parts list -- the Stevens front sight is described as having a "gold bead," just as the Mossberg description lists a "gold bead" in its front sight. One more model identifying distinguishing characteristic bites the dust.

    If you look at the finger groove on the pictured Stevens 52B you'll see that its much narrower then mine (so, more like yours), and located differently in the stock. These were inexpensive rifles, and while I think that these stocks were hand finished, I think it was done quickly and there there is probably a lot of variation among them, especially over time.

    Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Solddaboat View Post
    Well for starters... I think it is probably a Mossberg model 25/25A or maybe a 20-21-24...
    I have a model 10 and the biggest differences I can see from your pictures are (1) the base of the bolt handle where it is attached to the bolt is rectangular where mine is round (2) on my model 10 the stock is 23 1/2" and the finger groove on the forearm is narrower and ends only 1 1/2" from the front of the stock, where yours looks at least 3 1/2" or more. The barrel on a model 10 is 22" bet you a dollar to a donut your's is 24".... Will try to post a picture of my model 10 tomorrow.. The more I look at the models on damguy's site the more I think it is a model 20 or 21.... Anyone out there have one of them????
    Last edited by Gun_Shy; 02-13-2009 at 01:54 AM.

  8. #8
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    Dec 1969
    Location
    Southwest Side of the Metromess, Texas
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    226

    Default

    Well... send my your address and the $1 will be in the mail... Sure was looking forward to the donut....

    With a 22 inch barrel it has to be a variation of the model 10... it and the model B were the only production models with the 22 inch barrel.
    (I would guess the model B evolved into the 10)

    Here are the pictures of my model 10.... in pieces... still have a while to go on the semi restoration.. It had been stripped/bleached and pretty rusty with a repaired break at the grip when I got it..











    Last edited by Solddaboat; 02-13-2009 at 09:29 PM.
    You may all go to Hell, and I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett...1835


    NMCA Member #1966

    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in Overalls and Looks like Work.... Thomas Edison (1847 - 1931)

  9. #9
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    Dec 1969
    Location
    Southwest Side of the Metromess, Texas
    Posts
    226

    Default

    Here are a few more with the parts assembled....








    You may all go to Hell, and I will go to Texas. Davy Crockett...1835


    NMCA Member #1966

    Opportunity is missed by most people, because it is dressed in Overalls and Looks like Work.... Thomas Edison (1847 - 1931)

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Seattle area
    Posts
    29

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    West coast of central FL
    Posts
    7

    a lead for your bolt search

    Good Day, phishisgroovin!

    Saw your request for leads on a bolt for your Moss Mod 20/24/25 or so.

    I think this Gunbroker auction may be of help to you. You will have
    to register to be able to bid. This is a great website, I have found some
    repair parts that were in beautiful shape. It's worth your time. Just be
    careful of your bid prices, be able to walk away from an item. Some
    boneheads have gone way overboard on bidding.....JMHO.

    http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=126673410

    Good luck with your search. Welcome to the Mossberg shooting/
    accumulating/resurrection fraternity.

    Cheers! Paw-Paw aka [Funday-Plinker]
    I take a measure of a man by the work scars on his hands, how he looks me in the eye, and if he has a hearty laugh.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Chesapeake, Virginia
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gun_Shy View Post
    I have an old (early 1930s) Wards Western Field (aka Westernfield) Model 36 .22 bolt action. The cross-references show that Wards sold both the Mossberg 10 and the Stevens 52B (or 52B-62-83N) under this name.

    Does anyone know how I can determine whether my Model 36 is actually a Mossberg or a Stevens? In the few photos I have found, both look like the Model 36.

    Beyond just wanting to know its origin, I'd like to improve my odds of finding the right parts if at some point something needs to be replaced.

    BTW, many cross-references list this Wards .22 as a Mossberg 10 or a Stevens/Savage (same company) 521, but as the 521 is a shotgun it is clear that they are simply repeating the same error. The Stevens 52B is a .22 bolt action of the correct vintage.

    Bill
    Your rifle is a Stevens 52B. I don't know if it crosses over that way but it is definitely a Stevens 52B. I have a Sear's Ranger model 35 the same as your Westernfield 36 and it crosses to the Stevens 52B. I also have the parts diagram for the Stevens 52B and all the parts you show look exactly like the ones on my Ranger and the 52B diagram. Hope this helps you out.

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