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    Default Waiting to see how THIS goes

    https://www.newsweek.com/200-oklahom...rights-1512189

    200 Oklahoma Black Gun Owners Set to Rally for 2nd Amendment Rights.

    According to The Oklahoman, the demonstration is organized by Omar Chatman, 41, and is intended to bring attention to concerns that the Second Amendment rights of African Americans are not often respected.

    "I have encountered the police and observed them while holding my gun from a safe distance," Chatman said. "I've been displeased with every encounter. They treat Black men with guns with condescension and sarcasm. They should engage us as they would anyone else."

    Philip Smith, president and found of the National African American Gun Association, said law enforcement agencies and society as a whole typically have a negative view of African Americans who carry guns.

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    That's a problem??
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    I sincerely hope it goes well

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    Quote Originally Posted by Highrider View Post
    I sincerely hope it goes well
    Not all of it. Chasdev was target selective in posting this article. I support their right to bear arms but also understand they have a dangerous to our country underlying current that if they were not the correct color would be condemned by all.

    This is not an apolitical gun owners club.

    They are also calling police to be required to carry their own liability insurance and demanding that the World Court, also known as the International Court of Justice which falls under the United Nations jurisdiction, to investigate the U.S. for crimes against African Americans.
    The police liability insurance is not the real problem. The real problem is going to an outside agency with a dubious track record at best to weaken our country.

    https://www.newsweek.com/200-oklahom...rights-1512189

    A much more responsible organization is Black Guns Matter:

    Black Guns Matter educates people in urban communities in all 50 states on their 2nd amendment rights and responsibilities through firearms training and education.
    https://blackgunsmatter.myshopify.com/

    Toure has proposed arming urban residents and giving them proper training in an effort to curb violence that exists in cities like Chicago despite strict gun laws. He’s touted New Hampshire in the past where a license is no longer needed to carry a concealed weapon.

    “More so than just giving young urban people, of all races, firearms, giving them education about Second Amendment rights, giving them more education about conflict resolution and de-escalation tactics ‘cause that’s completely missing in urban areas like the city of Chicago,” Toure told FOX Business in 2017.
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/bla...an-communities

    Toure is advocating for good moderate folks who live in these poorer neighborhoods get educated on their gun rights and firearm safety so they can defend themselves and their families from criminals. He also advocates forging trusting relationships with the local law enforcement. This is a great program for winning back our streets from criminals that does not have a false narrative undertone but rather seeks to end the slaughter of innocents that goes on in our inner cities in the Black Community. There is no doubt to Mr Toure, Black Lives really do Matter and this would be a much more effective program without the radical politics.

    It is a gun organization that moderates could really support and more in line with responsible gun ownership.
    Last edited by davidsog; 06-20-2020 at 10:37 AM.

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    I wonder how far it would go if there were a Caucasian 2nd amendment group, or an asian one etc.

    I'm all for anyone who is pro 2nd amendment, but I am not on board with this as far as the African Americans can get away with their own named group. That in itself to me is discriminatory.

    And the black man who is complaining why blacks are treated differently than others with firearms. I think this gentleman needs to look within his own culture to answer that question.

    I'm tired of seeing things like this being sugar coated. When 13% of a population is committing a dispropportionately high percentage of said populations crimes, then it stands to reason why they all are generalized by the police, etc. Not saying the latter is right but it's time they start looking inward for blame.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    I wonder how far it would go if there were a Caucasian 2nd amendment group, or an asian one etc.

    I'm all for anyone who is pro 2nd amendment, but I am not on board with this as far as the African Americans can get away with their own named group. That in itself to me is discriminatory.

    And the black man who is complaining why blacks are treated differently than others with firearms. I think this gentleman needs to look within his own culture to answer that question.

    I'm tired of seeing things like this being sugar coated. When 13% of a population is committing a dispropportionately high percentage of said populations crimes, then it stands to reason why they all are generalized by the police, etc. Not saying the latter is right but it's time they start looking inward for blame.


    To look inward would be racist especially when the purchase/acquisition of firearms is concerned.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpw View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    I wonder how far it would go if there were a Caucasian 2nd amendment group, or an asian one etc.

    I'm all for anyone who is pro 2nd amendment, but I am not on board with this as far as the African Americans can get away with their own named group. That in itself to me is discriminatory.

    And the black man who is complaining why blacks are treated differently than others with firearms. I think this gentleman needs to look within his own culture to answer that question.

    I'm tired of seeing things like this being sugar coated. When 13% of a population is committing a dispropportionately high percentage of said populations crimes, then it stands to reason why they all are generalized by the police, etc. Not saying the latter is right but it's time they start looking inward for blame.


    To look inward would be racist especially when the purchase/acquisition of firearms is concerned.
    I meant the blacks need to look inward on a cultural level to find out what is causing their problems. I have no issues whatsoever with anyone desiring to protect themselves using a firearm. I've got no problems with anyone wanting to exercise their 2A rights as long as it's done legally . What is getting real tiresome however, is when stories like this one come out with a guy wondering why his race may be treated differently in the eyes of the police when firearms are present. I've already mentioned why I think that is so.

    Whats racist in my opinion is when white people are constantly being blamed for things that on a cultural level, the blacks themselves are the cause of.

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    To look inward would be racist especially when the purchase/acquisition of firearms is concerned.
    That is exactly the line they will give you and it is right out of this book:

    White Fragility: Why It's So Hard for White People to Talk About Racism
    https://www.amazon.com/White-Fragili.../dp/0807047414

    This thing is begin taught in schools and universities now. I highly encourage anyone who lives their life based upon their humanity and not their skin color get the principles of this thing out of our culture and back to the fringes where it belongs. It does nobody any good no matter what your background.

    It is just as racist as "Mein Kampf", Black Panthers, or the Klu Klux Klan in the conclusion that the color of your skin or ethnic background is either inherently good or bad. Pure RACISM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    I wonder how far it would go if there were a Caucasian 2nd amendment group, or an asian one etc.

    I'm all for anyone who is pro 2nd amendment, but I am not on board with this as far as the African Americans can get away with their own named group. That in itself to me is discriminatory.

    And the black man who is complaining why blacks are treated differently than others with firearms. I think this gentleman needs to look within his own culture to answer that question.

    I'm tired of seeing things like this being sugar coated. When 13% of a population is committing a dispropportionately high percentage of said populations crimes, then it stands to reason why they all are generalized by the police, etc. Not saying the latter is right but it's time they start looking inward for blame.
    It would not go far at all and be called down as racist. What the moderates of this country need to realize is that there is no system racism. That in fact, the United States is so sensitive to racism and finds it so abhorrent that it is now being used against us to silence the moderates into submission. Racial clubs that threaten violence or preach supremacy have no business in our country.


    There simply is no systemic racism. Look at NASCAR. NASCAR is considered by many on the ignorant left as the nest of white supremacy. When Bubba Wallace appeared to be the victim of hate crime, the everyday folks of NASCAR did not remain silent. They banded together and sent an unmistakable message that they would not tolerate the ignorance of racism.

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    There was a time when shooting a cop was a death sentence . NO ONE shot at cops !!!! Now it's routine and why, because someone did it and claimed he feared for his life , [DUH], and he got off.[ San Diego area I believe]. Today cops see someone with a gun, even holstered, they tense up and get ready. One false move by you, and they shoot. I don't care what color you are, if you have a gun in hand and the cops show up, you'll get shot by them . "GUN !!!!" they yell, and it starts . This crap about being disproportionately targeted is just that . You put your hands up and ask what the problem is and you'll live.Unless you're inside your house, and even then , leave the gun alone, you become a threat if you handle, display or possess a gun. It's a shame but it's come down to them or me with the cops ! Chasdeaf is just stirring the pot.

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    I got pulled over for running a stop sign on a roundabout by a hispanic cop I'm not hispanic BTW, white as snow cept for some freckles. It was one of them in a neighborhood. They are all over but none of the others have stop signs! This in a lower income neighborhood, go figure. Who the F puts stop signs in roundabouts!!!
    Had my license, reg and ins out before he got to the window. Cop walks up with his hand on his gun, saw my 9mm semi tucked between the seat next to me. He said " Wow, nobody has their stuff ready like that. Got a warning. The cop was really nice and said nothing about my gun.
    Best way to get shot by a cop is to be a dick and make sudden moves.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estaban View Post
    I got pulled over for running a stop sign on a roundabout by a hispanic cop I'm not hispanic BTW, white as snow cept for some freckles. It was one of them in a neighborhood. They are all over but none of the others have stop signs! This in a lower income neighborhood, go figure. Who the F puts stop signs in roundabouts!!!
    Had my license, reg and ins out before he got to the window. Cop walks up with his hand on his gun, saw my 9mm semi tucked between the seat next to me. He said " Wow, nobody has their stuff ready like that. Got a warning. The cop was really nice and said nothing about my gun.
    Best way to get shot by a cop is to be a dick and make sudden moves.
    They put the stop sign there as bait and you took it .Lots of that stuff out there .

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinkie View Post
    They put the stop sign there as bait and you took it .Lots of that stuff out there .
    Yup, didn't even see it.
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    I've been pulled over 4 times in over 40 years of driving. Twice by white cops, and twice by black cops. Guess which ones gave me tickets! The white cops. And I'm white. Guess I should say they profiled me cause I'm white.

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    Guess I should say they profiled me cause I'm white.
    I am sure that never even crossed your mind because most of us are focused on individual responsibility for our actions and think in terms of character, behavior, and our humanity.....not skin color.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidsog View Post
    Guess I should say they profiled me cause I'm white.
    I am sure that never even crossed your mind because most of us are focused on individual responsibility for our actions and think in terms of character, behavior, and our humanity.....not skin color.
    Nope. It happened strictly because I'm white.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinkie View Post
    There was a time when shooting a cop was a death sentence . NO ONE shot at cops !!!! Now it's routine and why, because someone did it and claimed he feared for his life , [DUH], and he got off.[ San Diego area I believe]. Today cops see someone with a gun, even holstered, they tense up and get ready. One false move by you, and they shoot. I don't care what color you are, if you have a gun in hand and the cops show up, you'll get shot by them . "GUN !!!!" they yell, and it starts . This crap about being disproportionately targeted is just that . You put your hands up and ask what the problem is and you'll live.Unless you're inside your house, and even then , leave the gun alone, you become a threat if you handle, display or possess a gun. It's a shame but it's come down to them or me with the cops ! Chasdeaf is just stirring the pot.
    At my city house
    If I am not expecting anyone, I have this practice of answering the door with a pistol in my hand. Twice the person knocking on the door was a policeman. I have a sidelight on each side of the door & each time they were so close to the door that I could not see who was there. I am still alive.

    Then there was the time an agent from the criminal division of the IRS showed up concerning a client. Same problem - too close to the door. The agent was unsettled (1) because I would not invite him into the house - we discussed the matter on the porch; (2) I holstered my pistol - which bothered him. So I told him to go and put his pistol in his car & I would put mine in the house. He said he could not do that & I said I could not either.

    At my country house, the practice is for 2 people to come.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estaban View Post
    I got pulled over for running a stop sign on a roundabout by a hispanic cop I'm not hispanic BTW, white as snow cept for some freckles. It was one of them in a neighborhood. They are all over but none of the others have stop signs! This in a lower income neighborhood, go figure. Who the F puts stop signs in roundabouts!!!
    Had my license, reg and ins out before he got to the window. Cop walks up with his hand on his gun, saw my 9mm semi tucked between the seat next to me. He said " Wow, nobody has their stuff ready like that. Got a warning. The cop was really nice and said nothing about my gun.
    Best way to get shot by a cop is to be a dick and make sudden moves.
    I have been stopped several times. My hand are always on the steering wheel. The first thing I do is to say that I have a firearm and where it is. Then ask for permission to get my license & CCW license out. And it is always Yes Sir, No Sir.
    Even with that I have a problem -- the address for the car is one place, the address on the driver's license is a 2nd place & the address on the CCW license is a 3rd place.
    Charlie
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpw View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by pinkie View Post
    There was a time when shooting a cop was a death sentence . NO ONE shot at cops !!!! Now it's routine and why, because someone did it and claimed he feared for his life , [DUH], and he got off.[ San Diego area I believe]. Today cops see someone with a gun, even holstered, they tense up and get ready. One false move by you, and they shoot. I don't care what color you are, if you have a gun in hand and the cops show up, you'll get shot by them . "GUN !!!!" they yell, and it starts . This crap about being disproportionately targeted is just that . You put your hands up and ask what the problem is and you'll live.Unless you're inside your house, and even then , leave the gun alone, you become a threat if you handle, display or possess a gun. It's a shame but it's come down to them or me with the cops ! Chasdeaf is just stirring the pot.
    At my city house
    If I am not expecting anyone, I have this practice of answering the door with a pistol in my hand. Twice the person knocking on the door was a policeman. I have a sidelight on each side of the door & each time they were so close to the door that I could not see who was there. I am still alive.

    Then there was the time an agent from the criminal division of the IRS showed up concerning a client. Same problem - too close to the door. The agent was unsettled (1) because I would not invite him into the house - we discussed the matter on the porch; (2) I holstered my pistol - which bothered him. So I told him to go and put his pistol in his car & I would put mine in the house. He said he could not do that & I said I could not either.

    At my country house, the practice is for 2 people to come.

    You need either a peep hole, or a Ring doorbell. We have both. With the Ring the person is on camera and I'm watching them before they even set foot on the porch. I can talk to them via the Ring from anywhere. This way no one is in any physical danger. And if it's a stranger, " smile because you're being recorded".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    You need either a peep hole, or a Ring doorbell. We have both. With the Ring the person is on camera and I'm watching them before they even set foot on the porch. I can talk to them via the Ring from anywhere. This way no one is in any physical danger. And if it's a stranger, " smile because you're being recorded".
    Agreed. Sounds like that is a necessity in your situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    I've been pulled over 4 times in over 40 years of driving. Twice by white cops, and twice by black cops. Guess which ones gave me tickets! The white cops. And I'm white. Guess I should say they profiled me cause I'm white.

    Only difference between a racist cop and a just-plain-tyrant cop is lack of a black person to push around.
    I am the grass. Let me work.

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    This situation has two main issues. 1. The blacks who want the world to see past the color of their skin, yet they use their color as reason for their every problem they have in society. 2. The white apologists who bow down every time something goes awry in black society. It's time both sides give it up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    You need either a peep hole, or a Ring doorbell. We have both. With the Ring the person is on camera and I'm watching them before they even set foot on the porch. I can talk to them via the Ring from anywhere. This way no one is in any physical danger. And if it's a stranger, " smile because you're being recorded".
    +1 on the ring doorbell! I answered mine while in Peru. Told some solicitor to get lost or I'll call the sheriff and he almost put his hand on the sign at the gate. The video is very clear and you can pull it up and download it.
    I have a whack job neighbor who said I was trespassing on her property and called the sheriff. Nice guy, met him before. Talked to him a minute on the ring and noticed he was getting perturbed. I walk out with my 9mm holstered and he is pretty calm. My property, my rules. I live in the sticks so I have other cameras and detectors set up. Been some home invasions nearby.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpw View Post
    I have been stopped several times. My hand are always on the steering wheel. The first thing I do is to say that I have a firearm and where it is. Then ask for permission to get my license & CCW license out. And it is always Yes Sir, No Sir.
    Even with that I have a problem -- the address for the car is one place, the address on the driver's license is a 2nd place & the address on the CCW license is a 3rd place.
    I do not ever declare a firearm. Not required in AZ. Just makes them nervous and itchy trigger fingers.
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    I have a bandana , red , yellow whatever, in each car and keep my gun under it . It looks like a bandana thrown on the seat or wadded up in the door storage space. I can pick it up and shoot without taking it off of the gun. I don't like to display my guns !! When I lived in Commiefornia, the law said you could have an unloaded gun in a locked case , and ammo separate , so I put a Beretta 92 , locked open, with 2 loaded mags in an attache case. If stopped, I spun the dials !!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Estaban View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    You need either a peep hole, or a Ring doorbell. We have both. With the Ring the person is on camera and I'm watching them before they even set foot on the porch. I can talk to them via the Ring from anywhere. This way no one is in any physical danger. And if it's a stranger, " smile because you're being recorded".
    +1 on the ring doorbell! I answered mine while in Peru. Told some solicitor to get lost or I'll call the sheriff and he almost put his hand on the sign at the gate. The video is very clear and you can pull it up and download it.
    I have a whack job neighbor who said I was trespassing on her property and called the sheriff. Nice guy, met him before. Talked to him a minute on the ring and noticed he was getting perturbed. I walk out with my 9mm holstered and he is pretty calm. My property, my rules. I live in the sticks so I have other cameras and detectors set up. Been some home invasions nearby.
    Yep. Had an old lady come to our door not long ago looking for the neighbor. Got the houses mixed up. I was in line at the market. Told her wrong house she wanted the next house up. Gotta love the Ring. Yeah they can be hacked or stolen, but whoever steals it is on candid camera so you can show the police at least what the turd who took it looks like.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    Yep. Had an old lady come to our door not long ago looking for the neighbor. Got the houses mixed up. I was in line at the market. Told her wrong house she wanted the next house up. Gotta love the Ring. Yeah they can be hacked or stolen, but whoever steals it is on candid camera so you can show the police at least what the turd who took it looks like.
    I don't use Ring inside the house so they can hack away if they want.
    The problem with those people that got hacked with the guy talking to their child through Ring was that their wifi was not password protected. Duh
    I got closed circuit video around the house I can check on my phone as well.
    Don't Violate My Airspace

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    Quote Originally Posted by Estaban View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidney Smith View Post
    Yep. Had an old lady come to our door not long ago looking for the neighbor. Got the houses mixed up. I was in line at the market. Told her wrong house she wanted the next house up. Gotta love the Ring. Yeah they can be hacked or stolen, but whoever steals it is on candid camera so you can show the police at least what the turd who took it looks like.
    I don't use Ring inside the house so they can hack away if they want.
    The problem with those people that got hacked with the guy talking to their child through Ring was that their wifi was not password protected. Duh
    I got closed circuit video around the house I can check on my phone as well.
    I think you are referring to the baby monitors that got hacked. I don't think your ring will cause that.

    I have heard of Rings getting hacked to where the bad guys would monitor the homeowners routines, and would wait until they weren't around and then robbed them. But again, password protection could have been an issue as well.

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    The anti gun politicians will have a hard time criticizing that one.

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    Beware of CCTVs which transmit through the internet or to a mobile phone. Recent warning in Oz news that there have been instances where they can be and have been hacked.

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    We’re all better off if everyone carries ...then it’s real!
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    When you hack a tv ..you get what? To change channels, turn up volumes?
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    Quote Originally Posted by DK PHILLIPS View Post
    When you hack a tv ..you get what? To change channels, turn up volumes?
    CCTV is a camera system DK. It means whoever hacks it can watch YOU thru the camera.

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    I remember it’s the tv in the living room..
    that set its own self up...internet.
    no cameras in it?
    “Grace+constitutional solvently strength, resistances to Chaos!”

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    Quote Originally Posted by DK PHILLIPS View Post
    I remember it’s the tv in the living room..
    that set its own self up...internet.
    no cameras in it?
    Are you sure?
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    Quote Originally Posted by DK PHILLIPS View Post
    I remember it’s the tv in the living room..
    that set its own self up...internet.
    no cameras in it?
    CCTV is not the TV in your living room. It is a camera. Most of these doorbell systems like the Ring have it.

    Best Video Doorbell Cameras
    Ring Video Doorbell
    https://www.safety.com/video-doorbells/

    A CCTV system (short for Closed Circuit television system) uses one or more video cameras to transmit video to a monitor, set of monitors, or video recorder.
    https://www.securityfive.com/2016/10...ding%20device.

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    CCTV= acronym for Closed Circuit Television. Not necessarily closed circuit these days, but originally that was it. Intended to allow surveillance of some area (store, for example), and that is still the purpose. Security system, or part of one.
    Absent comrades (sound of breaking glass)

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    Did you know all the data collected by the Ring doorbell (and other devices) is stored and processed for use by those enabled by Amazon to do so.....And cameras on devices can be activated without the knowlege of the user ,by certain authorized persons .....and others with the expertise to do so.

  40. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by john.k View Post
    Did you know all the data collected by the Ring doorbell (and other devices) is stored and processed for use by those enabled by Amazon to do so.....And cameras on devices can be activated without the knowlege of the user ,by certain authorized persons .....and others with the expertise to do so.
    1984 is here .

  41. #40
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    An alternative is to have a wireless system to a monitoring station/company, the transmitter of which has frequently changing random wavelengths. Any access is only between the parties concerned and not to the cloud.
    Beware of those gadgets that respond to voice command. Getting paranoid?

  42. #41
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    Clyde is offline Gold Bullet Member and Noted Curmudgeon
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    [QUOTE=staffy;10354515]An alternative is to have a wireless system to a monitoring station/company, the transmitter of which has frequently changing random wavelengths. Any access is only between the parties concerned and not to the cloud.
    Beware of those gadgets that respond to voice command. Getting paranoid?[/QUOTE]

    If not - prolly ought to be. I wouldn't have a lot of confidence in the monitoring station/company being all that secure, especially from cops. double especially Federal cops.
    Absent comrades (sound of breaking glass)

  43. #42
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    I’m so slow adopting things because of ignorance and non compliance..untrusted...
    things go out of style date and disappear...I haven’t been exposed to them enought to know what they are?
    “Grace+constitutional solvently strength, resistances to Chaos!”

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    You can have Alexa (amazon) access your Ring if you want but I would never have Alexa in my house. My "closed circuit tv" system is accessed through my wifi like the Ring but it's got a password so strong and long no ones ever gonna crack it. Besides it's just video of outside.
    Then there's the alarm system, then the big dog. Game cameras and driveway motion detectors. If you can get through all that without the sheriff getin here or me seeing it and calling them then ya gotta get into the safe room, then the safe.
    Plus the neighbors got a clear view of my driveway.
    I'll get pictures of them and their car.
    Paranoid? Nope, just security.
    Don't Violate My Airspace

  45. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estaban View Post
    You can have Alexa (amazon) access your Ring if you want but I would never have Alexa in my house. My "closed circuit tv" system is accessed through my wifi like the Ring but it's got a password so strong and long no ones ever gonna crack it. Besides it's just video of outside.
    Then there's the alarm system, then the big dog. Game cameras and driveway motion detectors. If you can get through all that without the sheriff getin here or me seeing it and calling them then ya gotta get into the safe room, then the safe.
    Plus the neighbors got a clear view of my driveway.
    I'll get pictures of them and their car.
    Paranoid? Nope, just security.
    The Ring may just be video of outside but, hackers who gain access can case your home by watching when people come and go. No guarantee to the bad guys that the home will be empty, but seeing no cars in the driveway at certain times of day is a clue at least to when there is a good chance that no one is there. But again it depends upon whether they can hack your account.

    I look at it from the perspective that Im also watching so if somebody did hack my account and was casing the joint, they still have to enter upon the property and chances are the same Ring they hacked would video them as well. Unless of course they somehow disabled it or wore disguises etc. The latter I still have them on video. I still think its a system worth having as not. I like being notified that someone is at my door, or for simply checking on the place when Im away, and say there's a big storm rolling through. I can get an idea if there was wind or hail damage,etc.
    Last edited by Sidney Smith; 07-01-2020 at 05:46 PM.

  46. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by DK PHILLIPS View Post
    I’m so slow adopting things because of ignorance and non compliance..untrusted...
    things go out of style date and disappear...I haven’t been exposed to them enought to know what they are?
    The best security system for bumkins like you and me Dan is designed by us and we don't tell anyone how it works

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